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post #1 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 01:49 AM
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Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Hello,

I am looking for some advice on buying an Eton Lightning AXL 50cc for my 8 yr old daughter. My local dealer is closing out on this model for the new Eton Viper models. The closeout price is $1299 plus $182 for shipping or setup costs. I read some good things about the Eton and at this price, it seems to be a great deal. Is there another opinion about the Eton thatI should know? Also, as my daughter gains skill and confidence, can you increase the speed/performance of this atv? Are there suggestions on what can be done without breaking the piggy bank?

Thanks...Ron

PS My wife and I are new to atvs and will be buying our first ones in the next few weeks.
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post #2 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 10:36 AM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Kasea is the best looking and best performing youth atv on the market. Currently 50 and 90cc atvís s are marketed by Suzuki, Eton, Polairs (Aeon), Aeon (Alpha Sports), Sundiro, T-Rex, Jehm, Kasea, Bombardier, Husky, Extreme Machine, Artic Cat, Yerf Dog, Manco, Dinli Helix (has an untested reverse feature), LEM and other manufacturers. Of the many atv manufacturers, Kasea offers features that go beyond the ďother guys.Ē Virtually all of the youth atvís are equipped with fully automatic CVT transmissions (except the Suzuki 50 and LEM 50) and a 2 stroke oil injected engine, the features that make Kasea superior to other youth atvís begin here:

Front suspension
The Kasea front suspension is much stronger than that Eton, Polairs (Aeon), Aeon (Alpha Sports), Sundiro, T-Rex, Jehm, Bombardier, Husky, Blazer, Extreme Machine, Artic Cat, Yerf Dog, Manco, Dinli Helix, LEM and some other manufacturers. The Kasea uses a double clevis style knuckle holder rather than the more common single holder. We believe that only Suzuki LT80 uses the same strong design as Kasea on the front suspension a-arms.

Rear suspension
The Kasea has the strongest youth atv rear swing arm and axle design on the market. It is a copy of the trusted design used by Yamaha on their performance atvís since the early 1980ís. No other youth atv has this strong of a rear suspension Ė it is simply the best. Many of the other youth atvís donít even offer a true sport atv style rear axle. We have found most youth atvís have a rear axle that is a thin metal shaft covered with tubing. Not only is the tube covered design weaker, it allows water to easily enter the carrier bearing area. Other youth atvís such as the Suzuki LT-80, LT50 and one Eton atv model do not even use a traditional rear swing arm. The LT80 and the one Eton model made the engine and transmission serve as the rear swing arm. The Suzuki LT80 and Eton design causes handling problems and is very difficult to modify for increased performance. On the Polaris and a few other models, the rear swing arm, although slightly longer, is too weak to be considered adequate.

Shock absorbers
Kasea built their atvís with true rebound and compression dampening Showa shocks that also feature compression preload spring adjusters. The only other youth atv that we have found that has a similar rear shock is Bombardier. Not even Suzuki has a good rear shock. This is a very important safety feature that is often overlooked. When the Kasea is ridden over a large sudden bump, the rebound dampening helps prevent the atv from ďbuckingĒ forward as the shock returns to its normal height. Compression dampening helps keep the shock from "packing" down.

Braking system
Kasea offers a traditional rear foot brake in addition to the front hand brake. This will allow your young rider to learn the proper use of hand and foot controls so he/she will be ready to advance to a full size atv with a manual clutch without relearning their riding technique. Some models such as the Blazer and Bombardier use full size levers that are hard for little hands to properly grip. The Suzuki 50 models do not even offer front brakes!! We will point out that the T-Rex, Manco, Sundiro and Yerf Dog have a rear disc brake but we feel that the drum brake in the youth market is sufficient for even racing needs.

Optional lighting
We believe that only the Kasea is equipped with a 80+ watt lighting coil and is pre-wired for lighting from the factory. All you need to do is purchase the Kasea lighting set that is found as standard equipment on the Kasea 150 atv or simply mount your own lights to the existing wiring. The key switch uses a third position to turn on the lights. Kasea even pre wired for a rear safety light and lighting for your whip antenna. No other youth atv on the market has this much lighting capability. If you want to add lighting to the Suzuki LT80, you will need a special electrical stator and wiring at a substantial cost. LT80 lighting kits that run off the battery only will result in a dead battery and a long walk home. The Suzuki 50 models cannot accept lighting.

Starting
Kasea, like most other youth atvís, offers electric starting with a manual back up kick starter and a fully automatic choke. Kasea studied the other atvís and took the ease of starting one step further. They added an automatic fuel valve. When the engine starts, the fuel is automatically turned on. When the engine stops, the fuel is automatically shut off. In comparison, the Suzuki and LEM models have manual chokes and all other youth atvís have manual fuel valves. We also note that if you want to add a manual back up starter to the Suzuki, it is a pull rope recoil starter that will cost an additional $80. In the unlikely event that you ever need a replacement electric starter for the Kasea, it will cost about $50 and can be installed in 5 minutes. The Suzuki starter costs about $250 and will require 3 hours of labor to complete the installation. The Suzuki 50 models only have pull rope starters that are difficult at best for young riders to operate.

Rim sizes
Here, you can easily install replacement rims of your choice! The front hubs use the common 4/110 bolt pattern (Honda) and the rear uses the common 4/100 bolt pattern (Blaster).

General Parts
Since most of the youth atv engines are similar, finding parts is usually not a problem. If you need gaskets, air filters, batteries, spark plugs, chain, tires or some basic engine components, Eton, Polairs, Aeon (Alpha Sports), Sundiro, T-Rex, Jehm, Kasea, Bombardier, Husky, Blazer, Extreme Machine, Artic Cat, Yerf Dog, Manco, Dinli Helix, will interchange. The Blazer, T-Rex, Bombardier, Yerf Dog, Manico and Polaris have a longer drive belt and side case cover though.

General Notes
The Kasea is one of the few youth atvís that does not provide a full floor board for the youth riderís feet. We have studied this issue and believe that the floorboard design may not be as good as claimed. In the event that the riderís foot gets wet or the board gets wet or covered with debris, it becomes a slippery dangerous platform. Kasea uses foot pegs just like a traditional atv. To improve any youth atv, we suggest that a good nerf bar with foot pegs and narrow spaced nets be added. I offer nerf bar packages for most youth atv models.

Speed
Kasea voluntarily follows the maximum speed limit recommendations of the Consumer Products Safety Commission. You may find other brands of youth atvís offered for sale that are out of the box ďfasterĒ than the Kasea; however, those atvís most likely do not comply with the CPSC regulations. For a new rider, there is no need for the extra speed out of the box. When their skills improve, the Kasea is the one to build.

Performance
From an aftermarket standpoint, I have the performance modifications for your youth atv. As your child grows, so will his/her ability to control more power. Instead of placing your child on a larger atv that can be dangerous for a younger rider to properly control, modifying a youth atv will provide the challenge that your child desires. I have replacement large bore cylinders, ported cylinders, custom billet aluminum cylinder heads, special over range transmissions, custom exhaust systems, performance carburetors, performance reeds, lighting kits, ignition systems, extended swing arms, wider a-arms, shock absorber kits and various tire and rim options. A special 4130 alloy frame is also in the works!
post #3 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 06:50 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. Excuse my abruptness, but who are you? I am new to atvs and to this site, forgive my ignorance.

I have read your other replies about Kasea and you appear to be genuine in your belief that they are the best youth atvs around. Unfortunately, I found a local
dealer who sells the 50cc for $1699 in Seattle, WA compared to the Eton at $1299 that even their salesperson doesn't think highly of them. In his own words, "the Kasea is made in Korea and has only been in the market a few years. You are better off with a name brand like Polaris for only $200 more, you will get better quality..." Here is another bash against the Kasea from the dealer who sells the Eton. They said that they didn't carry it because of the problems with how the oil flowed in the engine. The oil stops flowing when the rear wheels are not moving... This is what I remembered and I probably didn't get it completely correct. On the otherhand, I have read some good reviews on the Internet about the Kesea so someone isn't telling the straight story. One thing it did say is that the Kasea 50cc was slower than the others they tested. I rode the Eton 50cc and it is slow for me (I weight 4 times more than my 8 yr daughter so that needs to be factored) and I know she is going to come to me one day and say, this is slow, why can't it go faster? So, what can I do to a 50cc Kasea or Eton to make it move a little faster? Do you have a WEB site I can look at with all of your recommended modifications?

My first priority is safety for my child, close second is price. The Eton at $1299 plus $185 for F and Setup is very attractive. I do like the looks of the Kesea and the features it offers. For another $400 plus F&S, is it
worth it? I am not convinced that it is for an 8 yr old who may not enjoy the slower 50cc in one or two years.

Your opinion on all of this is greatly appreciated. I am just about to make a decision on the Eton in the next 1-3 days and based on your reply, I may go back and look at the Kesea more seriously. The other key is if the
dealer is willing to negotiate on the price.

Thanks...Ron
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post #4 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 07:44 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

You have been completely mislead by some dealers who clearly have no idea what they are talking about. In short, they are idiots.

Dealer cost for a Kasea 90 is $1593 -- the 50cc is $50 less. Add frieght and setup and you have a dealer price.

As for it being made in Korea, that is BS. It is made in Taiwian at Standard Motors, one of the world's leading manufacturers of this type of engine. They have been in business for years and their product is superior to most if not all others, including Suzuki (that is also made in Tiawian).

As for oil issues, again that is BS. They have the same oil injection system as every other youth 2 stroke atv. Gear oil is also the same as every other youth atv.

Speed?? Yes, out of the box Kasea may be slower than a few other youth atvs. That is because Kasea complies with the Consumer Products Safety Guidelines on speed for the 50 and 90cc models. If you have another atv that is faster, the company is breaking the law in order to try to show that their product is somehow faster =better. Go figure.

Why do some of these "idiot" dealers bash Kasea, well, Kasea costs the dealer more than any other brand. They make less profit. The dealer is not motivated by the quality of what they sell, they are motivated by $$.

I have NEVER seen front a-arms or a rear swing arm or axle break on a Kasea. Other brands, yes, I have witnessed nasty accidents when the parts fail -- most noteworthy would be the Aeon product wherein the front a-arms snapped off. Mind you, the a-arms on the Eton, Polaris, Sundiro, Xtreme, etc. are all the same poorly engineered design -- except for Kasea and Suzuki. Polaris is well known for rear swing arm failures. Is $400 worth it for your kid???

Oh, I almost forgot, Polairis is made by AEON, another Tiawanese company with a nasty habit for making low quality products (in my opinion).

Who am I, I will answer later.
post #5 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 09:38 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

We also are fairly new to the ATV market. I just purchased a 90cc Kasea for my 7 year old daughter who has surprised me with her skills. I did alot of research on this purchase based on her age, and abilities. Kasea outshined all of the competition. I almost fell for the Raptor 80, based on looks alone. The kasea is very agressive looking, and performs very well. Ours has approximately 40-50 hard hours on it, with NO problems. I weigh approx. 180LBS, and it moves me pretty well in stock form. (after removal of the throttle bushing) I am just a regular guy like you, looking for a safe toy for my children, for the right price. Like RAPTOR720 said, " What is your childs safety worth to you?" Just my personal opinion.
post #6 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 10:34 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

GUMBY66,

Thanks for your comments. WOW, a 90cc for a 7yr old!!! I think that is great. This is another issue I am struggling with. Do I buy a 50cc that fits my 8yr old now or buy a 90cc instead to save that extra step. My daughter sat on a 90cc Eton and she was able to reach the handle bars without any problems. Since you can turn down the power, I guess it shouldn't be a problem as long as your daughter can handle the controls and she feels comfortable on it. My daughter weight 59 lbs and stands 52". She is tall for an 8 yr old and she very athletic for her age.

Since you and I weigh the same (Okay, maybe 10lbs more but who cares), and you say the 90cc can getup and go with you on it, I think it should satisfy my daughter for a long time. I am not familar with this throttle bushing that you removed. Is this one of the speed limiters that Raptor720 is referring to about $0 cost modifications?

Can you tell me how much you paid for the Kasea including the freight and setup?

You and Raptor720 are helping me with my decision and I may be rethinking my plan on the Eton 50cc.

Safety is first on my list...Thanks...Ron
post #7 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 10:40 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Raptor720,

I am beginning to see clearer now, thanks to your comments. Another post by Gumby66 about his 7yr daughter with a 90cc Kasea is making me rethink my Eton 50cc idea. Can you tell me the dealer cost on a 90cc Kasea and what do you consider a fair price is including freight and setup?

Lastly, what modifications do you know that can be done on the Kasea and who are you???

Thanks...Ron
post #8 of (permalink) Old 06-05-2002, 11:07 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Ron,

In Southern Calif. I paid $1899, plus tax, lic., prep,etc. Total was $2243.00 "out the door" Throttle bushing/restrictor was a $0 fix, major improvement. Like you I did not want her to outgrow the 50 too quick, and necessitate another expensive purchase. I have yet to meet with raptor720, but plan to in the near future. His many comments pushed me in what I believe to be the right direction. He says they are unbiased, and I believe that. After viewing the MANY responses, I believe he knows what he is talking about!!

Brian
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post #9 of (permalink) Old 06-06-2002, 04:39 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Who am I??

Well, I am a guy who really likes to research and design youth atv products and, as my call name suggests, Yamaha Raptor 660 parts. I have been involved in racing and building racing components for well over 20 years. Street racing, boat racing, and PWC racing is where it began for me. I have a college degree related to the automobile engineering field in addition to extensive machine tool experience. I like to make things fast more than I like to ride things that are fast.

I got into the youth atv market a number of years ago when I saw a need to improve the only available youth atv -- the LT80. I quickly discovered the limitations of that machine and decided to curb any further research in the area (not before I developed a completely new transmission, big bore kit, suspension mods and a few other goodies). I also focused on the only available youth mini atv, the LT50.
I have posted a few of the basic mods for the LT50 on this and other sites and published the same in a couple of atv magazines.
Over the past few years, I began to focus on the newer (more modern) youth atv's that appeared as the CPSC voluntary curb on production of youth atvs came to an end. I quickly discovered that of the many brands appearing on the market, the Kasea would be my choice for my kids. Since the 4 stroke youth atvs are too heavy, slow and suffer from suspension limitations and a complete lack of serious interest with the public, I try to only focus on the 2 stroke mini.
Within a short time, I developed a high performance package that we ran in the sand dunes. The fairly mild system on the Kasea would easily out run any Blaster, 300ex, Warrior and most 400ex models to name a few. My goal was to keep my kids on the correct size atv instead of putting them on one that was way too big to be properly controlled by a 65 pound kid. (I get really pissed when I see junior on a 350 pound full size atv -- with the parents bragging about how accomplished their junior rides. This is a quick way to have a dead junior.)
After proving the Kasea on the sand, I moved into the race circuit with the Kasea. With a few additional mods, the Kasea went on to become the undefeated machine to beat. This included races against Roll Design style pro frame KX85 powered race atvs as well as Fisher style CR80 pro machines. WE can smoke them on near stock suspension and width except in whopps or large jumps. I am just about finished with some very awsome frames and suspension kits for the youth mini market. I am also working on a special project with Kasea that will turn the GNC crowd on their head.
I next talked with Trinity Racing about the Kasea and what I was doing to make it fast. Trinity quickly realized it was superior to any other youth atv and signed up to be a Kasea dealer. I still assist Trinity with the Kasea project from time to time.

Anyway, that is basically me. This is my hobby, I don't do it to make money (yet). In real life, I have a couple of day jobs.
post #10 of (permalink) Old 06-06-2002, 09:26 PM
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Re: Eton 2002 50cc purchase?

Raptor720,

Well, things have progressed since my last post. I told the Eton dealer no thanks and got my deposit back. I found out that Kasea's headquarters is in my city, Seattle, only 10 minutes away from my home. I spoke to a sales rep there who directed me to a dealer. I called them and now have a yellow Skyhawk 90cc on hold for me to look at and test tomorrow afternoon.

I have also learned more about you Raptor720 from reading messages I found on other boards. I have been to Trinity Racing to see their Kasea modifications (WOW!). You are everywhere and have been very helpful to others. Lets add me to the growing list. Good to have someone like you out there to help people like me make the right decisions. I will let you know what happens tomorrow.

Thanks...Ron
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