[414]

you know.. those nights that you can't go to sleep because you got a new idea going aroud your head.. damn, I have to work early tomorrow.. but what about putting the...

So last night I was thinking, if I'm looking for more power, why not put a v8 once and for all. I'm talking a small v8 here.. maybe a 305 or something..
In Costa Rica, the 4300 v6 is hard to find and rather expensive, while I can get a 302 or a 305 cheap.

I'm not into rock, I NEED hp to turn the wheels fast to get out of the mud bugs and going steep muddy inclines.

I'm goin to 35 boggers or 36 tsl's.. so I need a lot more power than what the 1.6 can give me...

any comments / suggestions / sleepless night about this?

Thanks guys,

Crzook

 

[Guest]

Seems you'd need to really beef up the front suspension, and possibly do some major cutting to fit the tranny in, then you'd have to beef up all the drivetrain, and axles, it might be easier to buy a junk Chevy s-10 blazer and adapt the Zuk body.... but with the right tools and attitude, anything can be done!
R/T

 

[676]

Check out the Rover 215.. all Aluminium small displacemnt V8, I have no idea how available thay are to you down there.

 

[414]

I can get one fairly easy and at a relativly good price.. what about tranny / t-case???
Sounds pretty interesting...

 

[414]

yeup, i'm going whith toy axles... but you have a good point about the front suspension.. I have cj7 suspension, do you think that it will handle the v8 fine? maybe go from a 4 pack to a five pack one?
Some cj7 had v8's right?

Thanks

 

[991]

the rover t-case, at least the series rover cases, had low onputs, both on the RHS, just like the zuks. Rover was the design consultant on the original SJ project so go figure there's some cross over. the Rover t-case, however, has a HUGE front snout on it, and both it, and the tranny are pretty big ( long) - I think you'd run into DS length issueson a standard whelbase Zuk. ( would probably work ok on a LWB)

umm, I'll possibly get flamed for suggeting it, but have you considered a Ford 302/ford RWD truck tranny (aka NP435), and divorced toyota case combo? thats V8, 6.7:1 1st gear, stock low on the toys is 2.28, or you could go with a Marlin 4.70 low set. Either way, its a 1:1 high range , which would keep on-road RPMS down. The only 'down' side is no OD on the NP tranny - BUT if you're going big tires, w/ lots of gears, thats not such a big issue to get around ( figure using 4.10, to 4.56's with 35" tires, and you'd still have tons of gears from the tranny + case). the only 'adapter' would be a divorced mounting kit for the toyota case, so its not a bad combo as far as parts go, either.

$0.02
chris

 

[801]

Sounds like a Suzuki Lightning is in your future

 

[682]

Jake (used to own Higher Heights Off Road) had a 400 SB, and he ran Land Cruiser axles in his.
I think there has been a couple others with V8's.

 

[Guest]

Yeah its totally possible and the way to make it wheel alot better is .....getting a jeep/bronco/scout. The weight biased will be wacky, you will nose plow everywhere. Think about road handling manners too, can you say scary?
I've been getting pm's about my name. Maybe I'll change it. But I love them both ZUKS AND JEEPS. The great thing about them is they are different. The Zuks lightweight is its greatest asset, why would you want to throw that out the window? Some places my zuk will go where my TJ couldn't or vice-versa but its usually a weight issue.
PS I've wheeled with a guy who has a lightning conversion, all I can say is this guy hates having to ask for an [censored]-strap when he goes down anything(it climbs up like a banshee though)

 

[991]

pretty easy to fix the weight bias ( unless your in a jeep 8^D) - is it a trail only ( or trail mostly) truck? rear mount the rad, put a bigger fuel tank (which you will need with a V8 anyway) back inside, by the 'tailgate', and mount a full sized spare over that. Under the back end, mount a Big assed winch, and rig a pulley under the rear bumper (plus routing tubes) so that it can do front, or rear pulls. fuel tank+spare+rad+winch are gonna be close ot the wieght of a stripped down 302, and you wont have THAT bad of a front/rear weight bias problem. 8^D

lateral thinking - 3 left turns make a right.

chris

 

[574]

Not to bad an idea Chris, but his power to weight ratio comes into effect, and in his adding weight to the rear to balance his front percentage, the gains of his v-8 start to cancel out due to his overall weight increasing. If to much weight is added, his additional power will be used up getting his increased weighted zuk to moving.

Jim

 

[855]

Just thow in a 4.3 or 2.8 both will give you ample power gains and with the right tranny's your zuk axles and x-fer will support them. Plus it seems there is a little more info avail. on these swaps.

 

[Guest]

I've been reading your post throughout the board (wonderer4x4), where have you been all my life?

I picture this little yoda-like guy who knows everything and has alot I could learn from.

The saying "anything is possible" is given a new meaning by this guy(wanderer4x4).

I'm sorry I do have to stay with my initial opinion, I think that a swb zuk that weighed 4000lbs would not be scary to wheel.

 

[991]

actually, none of that would be 'adding' weight - just moving it around ( most rigs find a radiator, spare tire, and winch useful). Yah, it'd be a lot heavier than a stock zuk, but seeing as he was already asking about different springs, I think 'mentioning' that is covered.

one trick no one ever mentions is playing with the front axle location, if you do a rear up front ( or any longer spring swap), and move the axle forward 1-2", you'd be amazed how it'll alter the front/rear weight bias. adding the heavier Ford box, and heavier toy case will also move the CG backwards....how much do you think a 302 actually weighs?

c.

as for 'yoda' commentary...guess you havent followed the link to my home page - the pleasant looking fellow under the 'author' tag would be me...my AK is in the back, anything else you'd like to add? (JK)

 

[574]

I am with you zuksenvy. Chris posts some very good tech.

I hope you dont think I was bashing your idea at all. I have spent alot of my teen and early twenty's cramming big engines in very small cars. Even put a big v-6 buick in a 75 B 210 datsun honey bee just for kicks when I was 17. Had a blast with that car. I currently have a 2000 cc toyota corolla hemi engine in my zuk with the toyota tranny.

There are always going to be pro's and cons to any combination you choose to do. I found plenty of cons on my toyota swap, but wanted something that was different, and I already had tons of parts.

With good fabricating, and some thought, you shouldnt have any trouble at all getting it to handle good. And it should eventually come down to what you want out of your rig, and what your needs are. You mentioned you had alot of mud running to do, so the power will be the big + for your application. If the positive's out weigh the negative trade offs for your application, thats all that matters. =)

Jim

 

[574]

Good points Chris.

Somehow it didnt register with me the fact that these were all pieces he would already be using, just moving from front to rear. The battery would also be a good piece to move to the rear as well.

Im not sure what the weight of a 302 is, or the tranny etc. but if hes going to yota axles, hes already got some of his weak links covered. I did a body lift on my zuk to clear transmission clearance issues, and hate it. If i had to do it again I would cut the tunnel and build one to clear.

Actually, the heaviest object you can move rearward in a vehicle can sometimes be the driver. Check out my pic of where I sit in my stock car I raced in 2000 LOL. : im 235 lbs: Its kind of hard to tell in the pic, but I am sitting where the passenger would have been sitting, which is back a little over 2 feet from where the front seat would be.

Jim

 

[574]

::as for 'yoda' commentary...guess you havent followed the link to my home page - the pleasant looking fellow under the 'author' tag would be me...my AK is in the back, anything else you'd like to add? (JK) ::

Done been all over your site back when I first saw some of your posts. Nice rig.

Jim

 

[Guest]

Sorry, I didn't mean that you would literally look like Yoda, I meant no offense by that.
Anyway, the 302,frame re-enforcemts,tranny, transfercase, axles and anything else added to offset the bias on a SWB zuk is what would be scary to me, my 4000lb statement was admittedly on the high side.
True if he did extend the front out the situation would be different. But I would still like to see a v8-built zuk on a 4 wheel scale.
I have found that just as important as power to weight ratios, weight to the amount of rubber touching also makes a huge differnce especially if he mainly wheels mud. Zuks don't have great power-weight, but where my zuk excels is in the low weight to contact patch ratio(I don't know the proper term). I run 38's on my TJ.....my zuk only needs 32's to be able to float on mud and sand like the TJ does. If my zuk could spin the 38's I couldn't imagine what it would be capable of(besides breaking alot).
Maybe an approach to look at for him would be to see how he could loose some weight?

 

[Guest]

aluminum v-8s dont weigh alot......you wouldnt be doing anyhting different than when you put toy axles and monster tires ect.. on..... do it up.... A v8 is not gonna end up at 4000 pounds.....

 

[574]

Once he his his balance on weight, Its not going to be to bad for him, if all of his drivetrain can handle the added torque he will be adding. Chris has a good idea about moving weight in the vehicle back, as that is free for the having. I used to have a program that would calculate what percentage of change a movement in weight makes, but I dont have it any longer.

Everything else considered, If i was going to use a small block chevy, I would go ahead and use the 350. On top of 45 more cubic inches that come with no significant increase in engine weight, its just a better engine to use. The 305 heads dont flow near as well as the 350, and I do think a little bit down the road when you dont break parts your going to go looking for more horsepower.

Jim