I thought the 71 was a C-101?

Adam G. Fisher
Boston, MA.

'72 Jeep Commando

http://www.angelfire.com/ma3/commando/

"Good, Bad, I'm the guy with the gun." - Ash

 

it is.

Thanks, Mike Childs
American Jeepster Club Webmaster

 

Buick 350 is a small block, 455 is a big block...different chunks o'metal.

 

Clearly...they are different chunks of metal. BUT...I heard in terms of length/width/depth/etc they are the same. Just wondering...all the torque in that 455 can make a guy drool...

 

According to the AA book the 455 is 2"wider, 7" longer and 1.5" taller than the 350.


C-Ya.....................kh

 

Hmmm, bummer on that 7" longer. That is vs. the Buick 350, right? While you have your tape measure out....do you know the distance between the firewall & the grille on a '71? Or, better yet, will the 455 fit if I remove that radiator extension thing that comes off the grille? Thanks.

 

how easy is the Buick 350 swap? Has anyone out there replaced their 225 with the 350...if so, what is involved...any sheetmetal/engine mount/bracket modifications needed?

71MtnJeepster(Jeepster named Ole'Joe)

 

Can't help you on that one. I got those measurements out of the Advance Adapter book.

C-Ya.....................kh

 

A 455 is a big large, but can be done. A tight fit, cooling troubles. A buick 350 swaps in nice from what i have seen, I think the 225 does fine considering the wieght to power ratio. All that tourque can make you drool, yea that is great, but where are your axle shafts? Better plan a bit more for your C-101. A C-104 is of the 72-73 variety.

John
I have the SM465! The SM is for Slow Mover, and the 465 is the wieght in pounds.

 

Also you can forget you even had a radiator extention thingy with any V-8 in a Jeepster, also might forget the backs of the headlight buckets too, give you a good picture? With the 455 the radiator is hanging off the front bumper, so what ever floats your chain......

John
I have the SM465! The SM is for Slow Mover, and the 465 is the wieght in pounds.

 

While I am new to Jeepsters in particular, I am not new to the off-roading game. I currently have a D60 rear & D44 front; both with 5.38s, sitting in my garage to become a part of the project. I also understand the cooling implications a 455 would create. That, as I see it, is actually the largest barrier to entry. Anything can be shoe-horned in via firewall, grill, fender et al modification, but if it won't be reliable for long periods on the trail, it is clearly impractical.

I've always tried to create dual purpose rigs, i.e. I can run down to the store in it... This time, however, I have a clean slate so to speak (I haven't turned a wrench on it yet & I haven't completely mapped out my build strategy) and I am leaning toward creating something completely, well, obnoxious....enter the 455.

Just trying to get the lay of the land before the body comes off and the garage door goes down.

 

In truth, the weight of a 225 V6 is enough to crack the front frame arch ahead of the firewall over time if you drive off-road at all. The few Buick 350's I have seen have produced similar cracks in less than a year. Whatever you do, plan on completely boxing the front frame rails, and if you are gonna do a forward steering box and power steering, get all the welding and fabrication done at the same time.

The only excuse to ever own a 455 and the only one I ever saw was for a purpose-built Commando tow vehicle. This guy put in new axles and power steering and power brakes and completely boxed the frame in front, and ended up trying to sell the rig when the frame broke in the rear from the strain of the huge boat and trailer - I think it went to the junkyard.

Truthfully, the slickest and fastest Commando I ever saw had a Turbo 231 including computer out of a Buick Grand National. This is still not an easy swap but you end up spending less money and having to fabricate less than any V8 change. The Turbo 400 tranny would be my choice for a V8 or Turbo V6, with all-new driveshafts because every U-joint in a Commando is undersized.

It's absolutely a mistake to try to make a fast performance vehicle out of a Commando, especially one with a lift, because the vehicle has a narrow track and a high heavy body. In truth, they all belong in the slow lane on the highway and never should be driven over about 55 MPH, slower if they've been lifted.

Gary
'67 Commando Pickup
'92 Cherokee XJ
'97 Wrangler TJ

 

Good to know RE: the frame. I'll have the body off before too long and potentially box that area.

Also, my intention is not to go fast with this rig...quite the opposite, in fact. I prefer that crawl thing, if you know what I mean.

 

You don't need a V-8 to crawl. Jeeps have been crawling remarkably well for many generations with a 4 cylinder engine. It's the quest for speed that has brought the larger engines into Jeep vehicles. A 225 will be more than adequate, a newer 231 will offer even more power. What you should concentrate on for crawling is your gearing. If you have the TH-400, you might want to consider the low gearset to change 1st from 2.48:1 to 3.00:1 and 2nd from 1.48:1 to 1.57:1. It appears that the Terra Low conversion for the Dana 20 will work for the Jeepster TH-400/Dana 20 combination. We should be seeing more on this in the near future. This would change the 2.03:1 low range to 3.15:1. These along with proper gearing in the differentials for the tire size being used will do more for crawling than stuffing in a bigger motor.

Tim
'66 Jeepster Commando w/Buick 252/4.1L V-6
'70 Wagoneer w/Buick 350 V-8

 

Yea, I agree with Tim, you need to wheel with the 225 V-6 first, with an injection system already figured out you might want the 225's low end torque and lots of gears. I have seen some sweet crawling wranglers and thier engine of choise is the little 2.5L four banger, the same engine in my wrangler when I swear at it going 40 MPH up big passes when the Jeepster goes 65.

John
I have the SM465! The SM is for Slow Mover, and the 465 is the wieght in pounds.

 

I have a 70 commando with a Buick 455/400 turbo and it will fit and clear everything using stock exhaust manifolds. Use the xmission cross member support to locate from if you don't want to buy new drive shafts. If new shafts are in the plan, move the engine as far back as you can and I think the 225 motor supports will fit the 455 motor mounts (pay attention to the drive shaft angles). The stock fan blade should clear in front. Otherwise, you will have to cut several inches out of the front cross member and box it for support. The fan shroud will have to go, new H/D radiator and electric fans. Still hard to keep cool. I cut off the old engine supports and built new ones ( be sure to center the engine up between frame rails. The 455 has a center hump oil pan and a 350 has a rear hump oil pan. Be sure that the oil pan will clear the front pumpkin under compression. The 350 weighs about 450 lbs.and the 455 about 600 lbs.Chase down an Oct. 2000 issue of Four Wheeler Mag and turn to page 92 for all the dimensions you will ever need. MY 445 is about 450 hp with lots of goodies. Still if I had it to do over, I would seriously consider the Buick 350. I have been playing with mine for a couple of years and with 3.31 gears and 32" tall tires, I still have more power than I know what to with. I may have skipped some things, but if I' ll answer any questions I can.

Best of Luck

Dennis In Colorado Springs

 

Looks like popular opinion is trying to steer away from the 455, and my 2 cents won't play devils advocate. If you're muddin' and runnin 44" tires you'll need every inch of the 455, but for crawling....

If you gatta have the V8 I'd go with the 350, being that it is the same block as the 225, and the 350 still has an aftermarket following, so plenty of "go-fast" goodies. To go full on without the weight I'd definitely go for the 231 Grand National motor. A turbo V6 would be excellent for trails, with fuel injection you're fairly kill proof. The RPM arear you look to be in for crawling would be perfect for the boost curve in a turbo (3000-4000 rpm), and the weight/power ratio with the V6 is better than the best built V8 will ever see... (thus you see so many import hot-rods out there, people are turning 9 second 1/4 mile times in 4cyl turbocharged Hondas!)

A turbo... the only replacement for displacement!

Josh K
... the Jeepster stays .../wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif

 

Here is a question for the experts here. I wanna put an AMC 401 in my 1971. Scratch that, I'm GONNA put a 401 in my 1971 and was wondering if anyone has ever done it.

Im gonna use a completely different driveline and understand all of the issues that come with putting the 401 in the Jeepster. What I wanna know is how difficult is it going to be to showhorn that baby in there? I know that all of the sheetmetal behind the radiator will need to be whacked and the crossmember under the 225 removed but what else?

Thanks for all the input.

AMC401V8

 

Cut the sheet metal to move the radiator forward. Have the radiator re-cored to 4 core high efficency. Get a radiator shroud if you keep engine driven fan. Weld in AMC motor mounts. Assuming you already have the BOC TH-400 tranny, you'll need a AMC engine to BOC TH-400 tranny adapter found on '72-'73 Jeepsters and FSJ's. I loved my AMC 401 in my '76 Waggie, but would reccomend doing the Buick 350 instead. Easier and lighter. Check out David Kauer's website regarding Buick 350 conversion. http://revolution.3-cities.com/~commando

Tim
'66 Jeepster Commando w/Buick 252/4.1L V-6
'70 Wagoneer w/Buick 350 V-8

 

Thanks for the note. I had the A-1 low gearset in a former TH400 I had behind a 304 in a CJ. I liked it. I currently have a set of Bronco gears for the D20 (2.46:1)...for efficiency reason ($$) I will machine the case for those and forego the terra set up for now.

My last rig, a '94 YJ, had the 4.0L, 5.38s, NV4500, and the 4:1 xfer case gearset, i.e. 121:1 crawl ratio...I understand the concept. I just have this hair up my @ss to have a V8 again...it's been awhile.