Paint gurus - painting over paint

Unknown member · May 17, 2001

I finally shot my `84 with paint Monday afternoon. The 'paint booth' I used had poor overhead flourescent lighting and I was painting dark blue. The end result - The truck looks awesome except for one spot about the size of a basketball on the passenger's side of the bed where you can kind of see through the paint to the primer. It looks like a cloud (gray-green primer with blue over top). I couldn't see it when I was painting, but after I pulled the truck out of the garage yesterday and looked at it in natural light, it stuck out like a sore thumb. I'm not making a show truck here, but I do want the truck to look good.

The paint is DuPont Centari and I cut it with hardener and DuPont Mid-Temp reducer in the appropriate ratios. I have about 1/4 - 1/3 of a gallon of paint left, enough to lay on a good coat of paint, maybe two over the entire truck. I'd prefer to shoot the whole truck as this would allow me to sand out a sag on the driver's side that I didn't notice until yesterday either.

What are my options and the recommended course of action? Can I paint over the paint with the same mix without it lifting, orange peeling, cracking, sagging??? I really don't want to strip all the way back down to primer, then spend another $200 on paint and materials.

Unless someone comes up with a better idea, I was thinking about using red Scotch-Bright pads to scuff the paint, then a quick wipe down (but with what? No laquer thinner - it would strip paint!), and reapply paint.

Thanks for any suggestions and help.

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366 · May 17, 2001

I can't answer your question because I'm not a paint wizard, But I whould like too know how much paint you used? I'd like too paint my truck sometime soon and need a idea how much I'll need too buy.

A Man a Dog and a Pickup it's a wondurful thing(sometimes)/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif

Guest · May 17, 2001

I used approximately 2/3 to 3/4 of a gallon to paint my full-size, but I didn't spray the inside of the bed as I will be putting Herculiner on after I get the paint situation figured out.

I'd get a gallon of paint for a full size. It's better to have a little too much paint than not enough to finish the job.

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Guest · May 17, 2001

Just use the red Scotch-Bright pads and wipe it down with a tac rag just before spraying. No need for "wax and grease remover" (which is what you should wipe down with, not lacquer thinner) when going back over fresh paint. Note: different paint systems have different "recoat times" where you can add another coat without scuffing. I'm sure you have exceeded that by now but it is something to look at in the future. Also check to see the recommended time before sanding.

One other thing, with most solid colors, you can probably get by with just painting one panel as long as you measured the mix (as opposed to guessing). If you can duplicate the mix, air pressure, and temp (within reason) then the only variables are your technique (speed, distance, and gun adjustment). Even being your first time you should be able to get close enough to consistent for it to work out fine. Note: This does not apply to pearls, metallics, micas or other "trick" paints, only to solid colors. These types of paints are tough for a professional to "spot paint" much less a beginner.

Good luck, sounds like you did pretty well for a first time. Even pros have trouble in bad lighting. I spent over $2k in lighting and stuff for my booth to get good results (years ago when I had one).

Bad Dog

85 K30 CUCV, 350 TBI, TH400, NP205, D60/C14FF locked 4.56
Soon: 4" lift, 40" tires, massive cutting, shorter wb and rear overhang.

RyanB · May 17, 2001

Yeah, lighting is the key to success...I don't have much experiance in automotive finishing but I have done top end furniture finishing dealing with toneing alot and when in the booth it looks great and as soon as you bring it out into the natural light you start seeing where there is way to much or not enough. Toneing is for sure the worst because the clear laquer has color pigments in it. Anyway, we found the best way to fix the lighting problem was to punch some holes in the walls and ceiling and instal some huge ass skylights which worked great....untill of course it got dark out/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif

Ryan

93 GMC Yukon
Chevy SuperStock 4x4 Truck Puller
Great Lakes Truck & Tractor Pulling Association
http://www.greatlakespull.com

Guest · May 18, 2001

Just shoot the trouble panels after you get them ready. If th rest of the truck looks good then that will be all that is required. Like was said before on a solid color you shouldnt have any problem getting it to match ok. It may look a little different at first but after it cures it should look ok.

Guest · May 18, 2001

Thanks guys,

I am going to try to fix it up tomorrow and Sunday as we are supposed to have some decent weather. I am also going to pick up my light stand with dual 500 Watt flood lights to shed some more light on the situation before I squirt more paint.

I am going to use some 1000 grit paper to wet smooth out the trouble spots (the two sags and one drip), then use a red Scotch-Bright pad over the panels that need more paint, mask off everything I don't want paint on, tack rag it off, then spray paint.

I'm excited... I'm ordering up my new tires and wheels today - hopefully I'll have pics to post of the completed project within the next week!

Project: BAD MUDDER; nearing completion.

I like animals. They taste good. /wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif

Guest · May 18, 2001

Quack_Addict where did you learn about your bodywork and paint techniques?
I am almost ready to start doing somebody work on my full size and I also want to paint it myself.
What did you use for a primer? Rattle can primer?
Did you buy a book?
I could use any tips you could throw my way.
Thanks
Looking forward to seeing a picture of the new paintjob.

Zooman

/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif78 Chevy 3/4 in the rough

Guest · May 20, 2001

Zooman,If this is your first paintjob go with the sandable primer you mix with laquer thinner yourself. If you have never done a paint job I would recommend getting a book and then talking to everyone you know that knows how to paint. There will be lots of little things you will run into that you will need answers to. For the first time I would use acrylic enamal in a solid color ( not metallic ). Preperation is 95% of the job. Note...It is a fine line between a slick finish and a run. /wwwthreads_images/icons/tongue.gif If there is any part of it I can be of assitance just let me know.

Guest · May 20, 2001

Thanks for the help.
Is there something wrong with rattle can primer?
I just figured they would be easier to use.

Zooman

/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif78 Chevy 3/4 in the rough

Guest · May 20, 2001

I dont think it builds up as well as the mix type and it is a lot more expensive too. The whole idea of sandable primer is to get rid off minor imperfections. It has to build up and then be sanded back to fill all the little spots.

Guest · May 21, 2001

Thanks for the tip.
I have quite a few of rattle can primmer laying around, I figured it would be just as good. When I start the body work I will get some of that good primmer.

Zooman

/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif78 Chevy 3/4 in the rough

Guest · May 21, 2001

I picked up on most of what I know about painting from my brother. He's REALLY into `70's Trans Am's and I've helped him repaint several. This was my first time actually painting anything bigger than accessories, but I have shot primer a bunch of times.

Don't be afraid to ask questions to people who know - the people at the paint shop normally really know their stuff and they can give you some good tips.

All I can say is make sure whatever you are painting is PERFECT. Prep the trouble spots on the body in "as-is" condition (ie. sand/grind off rust and paint in the area, treat rusted areas with Extend and fill holes with Duraglass or Marglass). Use a fiberglass filler as opposed to Bondo to plug any rust throughs - fiberglass fillers are waterproof; Bondo is a sponge. Sand down the filler (okay to take off a little too much), then put on a thin coat of Bondo - then sand most of it off. Bondo sands A LOT easier than fiberglass fillers and the fiberglsss filler and epoxy primer & paint will seal it on both sides from water.

Get the body as close to good as possible. Sand all paint until all the gloss is gone.

Spray with sandable primer (50/50 mix of primer and thinner), then sand most of it off using finer sandpaper every time. Sand one body panels at a time - USE A BLOCK.

Spray with sandable primer again (for a really nice finish), then sand most of it off. This is just a precautionary coat in case the first coat didn't fill enough.

Spray with epoxy primer (good at preventing rust from coming back). Scuff the epoxy primer with a red Scotch-Brite pad after a day or two. PPG DPLF is a good choice, but it's pricey.

Within a week, spray your paint. Any drips or sags can be wet sanded and buffed out after the paint hardens well.

Be sure to use hardener if your paint is compatable. If you don't use a hardener, your paint job will still look good but it'll need to be redone in a year.

Sandable primer (Kondar) - ~$80-100/gal
Epoxy primer (PPG DPLF) - ~$150-180/gal
Epoxy primer hardener - ~$25/quart (2:1 mix of primer and hardener)
Laquer Thinner - ~$8/gallon (cheap stuff) - use this for clean up
Laquer Thinner - ~$15-20/gallon (DuPont) - use this with primer
Reducer for paint - ~$20/gallon (DuPont)
DuPont Centari paint - ~$140/gallon (paint I used); price varies depending on color and metallic/nonmetallic
DuPont Centari hardener - ~$40/pint

Let me know if you have any questions, I might be able to point you in the right direction.

Dan

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Paint gurus - painting over paint

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