The last thread got a little long for me, so I'll start the conversation anew...
Try to get into the habit of saying 'Firearm' instead of 'Gun' or 'Weapon'....
I know that it's just a word, but the left wingers are winning with words....
These are my opinions, and are based on years of ownership and use of several different firearms down through the years.
I'm also a NRA and Military qualified instructor in the use and handling of firearms.
It's also based on what the average 'Joe' can afford, and contains nothing but current production models when some firearm in particular is mentioned.
HOME DEFENSE.
Pump Shot Gun. No Question.
Every bad guy in the world knows the sound of a slide and bolt on a pump gun being worked, and will jump through a fifth story window to get away from it.
4-10 or 20 gauge for women, 12 gauge for men.
Holds plenty of rounds, and if loaded with light buck shot, drywall will stop ricochets.
Legal in all 50 states with a 20 inch barrel at last call.
Most states will allow pistol grips as long as the overall length is more than 28"
(In Indiana it's 18" barrel from closed bolt, 26" overall. Barrel has to have front sight or bead)
BEST ALL AROUND FIREARM.
20 or 12 gauge pump shot gun.
With everything available from aerial flares to deer slugs over the counter, and some really wicked specialty ammo, like chains, wires, and flechettes, the pump shot gun is dependable as an anvil, and versatile as a swiss army knife.
Legal in all 50 states, (some of the above mentioned ammo isn't) and available to everyone for under $200, it's the choice for everything from home defense to recreational shooting.
BEST SURVIVAL FIREARM.
Over and under combination, 20 or 12 Gauge shot gun with a .22 cal. rifle.
I prefer 4-10 gauge and .22 cal. myself. Easier to carry more ammo.
The 4-10 through 12 Gauge offers large knock down power with slugs, and spread pastern effectiveness with shot shells. There is a wide variety of ammunition available for the 4-10, and it's available in all 50 states, and most of the world.
The .22 cal. rifle barrel allows pinpoint accuracy, and the advantage of much more ammunition storage in the same space.
The relatively short barrels allow for easy storage, and ease of use in even the thickest underbrush.
BEST CONCEALED CARRY FIREARM.
Hammerless or concealed hammer revolver in .38 special.
Black or dark blue, never chrome, nickel or stainless steel unless you paint it flat black.
The 5 shot detective's model is very good if you can find the concealed hammer version.
Don't go for fancy sights, or large hammers or anything sticking out on the piece.
All of that is just something else to get caught on your clothing, ect.
I don't recommend semi-automatics for concealed carry for the average citizen.
If they have to be fired under a jacket, or in a pocket, semi-autos have a tendency to jam.
Large volume guns are not recommended, because most close range shootings consist of only one aimed shot anyway.
.38, .38 special, .38 special Plus P, .357 mag. are all good concealed carry revolvers.
.38 Special will punch through everything a would-be assailant would wear save a small arms resistant vest. Street punks don't wear body armor, but they do wear leather jackets with god knows what in the pockets, and layers of sweat shirts.
I've seen cases of .25 auto, .32 cal., .380 and even 9MM rounds being stopped by heavy leather jackets.
A .38 special or better WILL reach it's target.
BEST ALL AROUND HAND GUN.
The Ruger Six Shooter, (GP Series!! GP stands for General Purpose, like your Jeep).
Good adjustable sites, good grips, large handle, 4" or 6" barrel make for being able to hit the target, reasonable size cylinder release, really good safety features and a muzzle design that isn't damaged beyond repair the first time it's dropped on the ground.
(all guns that are used get dropped sooner or later, it's just a fact of life)
Everybody makes something for them, and Ruger has one of the best warranties in the business.
.357 mag is a good all around cartage. Good for hunting, and .38 specials can be fired out of it when you are just doing target practice.
Stainless steel construction makes it virtually impervious to sweat and weather.
BEST SEMI-AUTO HANDGUN.
The Taurus PT-92, 99, 101.
Built in Brazil on machines from Barretta.
Barretta parts will interchange for the most part.
The older style PT-92 with no de-cock is my first choice, but may not be available everywhere anymore.
NEVER TRUST A DE-COCK!!
I've seen dozens of accidental firings because somebody was foolish enough to think that a de-cock was safe!!
Always let the hammer down by hand, by putting your thumb in between the hammer and the slide.
Taurus has a lifetime warranty, and they stand by it. It takes a while to get your firearm back, but usually, they send you a new firearm instead of repairing the old one, or give you lots of new parts on your old frame.
The PT-92 is almost identical to the Barretta 92, with a few important differences...
1. Taurus is $300 cheaper and has a lifetime warranty.
2. Taurus will fire with the magazine out.
3. Taurus safety goes the correct direction, down to fire.
4. Taurus with out de-cock can be carried 'Cocked and locked', meaning the hammer cocked, and the safety on. Barretta will de-cock when the safety is put on.
5. If you file on, or change to a Barretta magazine catch, you can use Taurus or Barretta magazines. Barretta magazine catches will interchange with Taurus magazine catches.
6. Any specialty barrel made for a Barretta will fit right into a Taurus. so will the barrel locks, springs, slides, grips, ect...
If you decide to buy a Taurus or Barretta for target practice, make sure you get the good adjustable rear sight, instead of the minimal 'combat' type sight.
I can't imagine why anyone would want to use a semi-auto for target practice... Unless you were going to try for one of those silly cop style rapid fire matches where you plan to miss lot.
MOST FUN FIREARMS...
Muzzle loading!!!
Love those black powder guns!!
Low pitch roar instead of brain sucking high pitched crack...
The smoke! The smell of the cordite, the gun bucking in your hands...
The fact that in most states, you don't need any permits to own or carry muzzle loading pistols....
Yes, in most states, you can carry a loaded muzzle loading pistol with out permits legally.
I find it real fun to mold my own balls, and sometimes even make my own black powder.
I'm still working on making a reliable cap...
Flint locks are a ball of fun too, but they can be a real pain in the butt to find parts for.
If you don't enjoy taking your guns apart and cleaning them, I recommend you take up another hobby!! Black powder is corrosive, and the guns must be cleaned very thoroughly immediately after you are done firing them.
They will rust and corrode into junk in just a day or two of you are not careful.
BEST LONG RANGE HUNTING RIFLE.
The Remington 700 ADL/ BLD platform.
Available in may calibers, and in long bolt or short bolt configuration.
Get the synthetic stock if you plan to hunt with the rifle, it's more accurate, and stands up to knocks and scrapes much better.
Very accurate from the factory, everybody makes something for them, and they are very reliable.
Reasonably priced, and available everywhere, and no state restrictions on bolt action rifles.
BEST TARGET FIREARM.
Ruger 10-22, .22 Cal. long rifle.
It's the best plinking and target firearm around.
Tough, reliable, cost effective, available everywhere, and everybody makes something for them.
.22 won't break your budget, shoulder, or your ear drums to shoot all afternoon.
It's a rim fire rifle, so it's not going to be on the ban list just yet...
BEST RECLUSIVE "NUT-JOB" GUNS...
If you are ready to move into with the Weavers in Idaho, or Move to a compound in Waco, your best bet is to stay in groupings... So you don't have to stock tons of parts for twenty kinds of firearms and 20 different calibers of ammunition.
For a closed compound, quantity of ammunition is more important than the types of firearms, but types of fire arms are second on the list, then comes spare parts.
=====================
Self reliance is an art, practiced by intelligent people, not jumped into to by alarmist paranoids for fear of the unknown.
That extends to food and water, medical supplies and know how, and mechanical intelligence is more important than stock piling firearms and ammo.
You must make allowances for a good pantry, food, spices like salt and canning supplies, and a good stock pile of medical supplies and living goods, like soaps and toothpaste.
Seeds for a garden are a must for long term self reliance. A green house or hot beds would be a good idea also.
Health care is important, all the guns in the world won't do you any good if you have an abscessed tooth or infected cut, or have nothing to eat or drink.
Prepare for a natural disaster first, flood, earthquake, tornado or hurricane, then worry about the government, ours or some other country...
=====================
If you choose the 7.62 X 39 MM caliber, then stay with the SKS or AK-47 Knock offs.
They are cheap, available almost everywhere, and magazines are very available.
Ammo is dirt cheap, but usually not reloadable.
Chinese imports can some times be undependable.
If you choose the 7.62 X 51 MM (match .308 cal.), then stay with the M-14, the FN-FAL, or the HK-91/ G-3 platforms.
Civilian platforms include the remington pump and semi-auto versions, (76 and 760, I think..?)
Magazine fed, semi-auto, and available but expensive.
Not really good for hunting or target practice, but might make you feel better if things take a turn for the worst.
Ammo is available in both military surplus and civilian markets, most types are reloadable.
This is the larger NATO chambering, so ammo will always be available.
The AR-15 can also be chambered for 7.62 X 39 MM very easily, and is a very reliable.
If you choose the 5.56 X 45 MM (Rem. .223) The Colt AR-15 is the obvious choice.
The AR-15 is the civilian version of the US military M-16, and comes in about three hundred different variations. Everybody makes something for them, and parts and magazines are everywhere. Very simple platform to work with.
There is also the civilian Ruger Mini-14. It's very reliable, comes with inherent reliability, and is a top quality firearm. Available almost anywhere.
Almost all 5.56 MM chambered firearms are semi-automatic, and magazine fed.
There are several variations of the AR-15 made by dozens, if not hundreds of manufactures.
The AR-15 has been used by civilian and military markets, and has been chambered in everything from .22 rifle to .308 cal.
Common variations are, .22 long rifle, 9MM, .223 cal, 7.62 X 39MM, .45 Auto., all using the same basic platform, just changing magazines, bolts and barrels.
They came as pistols, as folding stock short barrel assault rifles, as long barrel rifles, and as sniper rifles.
There is even a top end made that will convert the rifle to belt feed for sustained rates of fire.
If your choice is the 9 X 19 MM platform... (common 9MM)
You will need two basic types of firearms.
Compact side arm type handguns, and the larger high volume type 'carbine' style rifle.
Good choices would be the Browning Hi-Power, Barretta/ Taurus, or the Glock in 9MM, and the AR-15, UZI or MAC type rifle. The Marlin camp carbine in 9MM would be a good choice also, without running into the ban rules.
KEEP THE LONG BARRELS.
9MM has no real range, so you will need all the barrel you can get.
9MM ammo is plentiful and cheap, and is the current NATO standard, so it's available in surplus.
If your choice is the .45 Auto platform...
Same thing as the 9MM advice...
Compact side arm, like the Colt model 1911 in .45 auto and the Thompson, AR-15 or MAC style carbine style rifles.
AGAIN, KEEP THE LONG BARRELS.
.45 has no real range, so you will need all the barrel you can get.
.45 auto ammo is plentiful, but not nearly as cheap as it used to be.
The US military still uses it, but surplus ammo is scarce these days.
---------------------------------
The best all around choice is the 12 gauge pump shotgun.
It does more cheaper than any other firearm. Ammo and custom parts are everywhere, and there is no more hard hitting firearm than the 12 ga. pump shot gun.
The second choice is the AR-15 rifle platform.
The AR-15 choices seem to be endless.
I've seen them adapted to fire everything from paint balls to 4-10 ga. shot gun shells.
They are common in .22 long rifle, 9MM and .223 cal.
Everybody makes something for them, and ammo and parts are everywhere.
Simple and quick to maintain and modify.
----------------------------------
I do not advocate doing anything illegal.
We live in a country that is ruled by law, and no one, no matter what their intentions are, should break the law.
If you really must own a full auto, or a 'chopped' firearm of some kind, then get the proper licensing for it.
Any US citizen that hasn't had a felony conviction or mental illness can legally own a fully automatic firearm. I urge you to obtain that certification if you wish to possess a full auto firearm.
If you want to 'Experiment' with firearms, get a Class II Manufacturers' License and have at it. That will make most things legal, and you will be able to register it with ATF after you make something tricky.
I do not advocate carrying or using a hand gun unless it's properly registered and licensed.
Handguns have little or no use outside if target shooting or hunting.
A readily available handgun can turn a minor altercation into a major tragedy really quickly, so I urge everyone that wants to carry a handgun to get the proper license and training.
Training is essential for safe operation, even for police and military, the difference being, the police and military recognize that fact, and many civilians don't.
"I Have The Body Of A God... Buddha"
Try to get into the habit of saying 'Firearm' instead of 'Gun' or 'Weapon'....
I know that it's just a word, but the left wingers are winning with words....
These are my opinions, and are based on years of ownership and use of several different firearms down through the years.
I'm also a NRA and Military qualified instructor in the use and handling of firearms.
It's also based on what the average 'Joe' can afford, and contains nothing but current production models when some firearm in particular is mentioned.
HOME DEFENSE.
Pump Shot Gun. No Question.
Every bad guy in the world knows the sound of a slide and bolt on a pump gun being worked, and will jump through a fifth story window to get away from it.
4-10 or 20 gauge for women, 12 gauge for men.
Holds plenty of rounds, and if loaded with light buck shot, drywall will stop ricochets.
Legal in all 50 states with a 20 inch barrel at last call.
Most states will allow pistol grips as long as the overall length is more than 28"
(In Indiana it's 18" barrel from closed bolt, 26" overall. Barrel has to have front sight or bead)
BEST ALL AROUND FIREARM.
20 or 12 gauge pump shot gun.
With everything available from aerial flares to deer slugs over the counter, and some really wicked specialty ammo, like chains, wires, and flechettes, the pump shot gun is dependable as an anvil, and versatile as a swiss army knife.
Legal in all 50 states, (some of the above mentioned ammo isn't) and available to everyone for under $200, it's the choice for everything from home defense to recreational shooting.
BEST SURVIVAL FIREARM.
Over and under combination, 20 or 12 Gauge shot gun with a .22 cal. rifle.
I prefer 4-10 gauge and .22 cal. myself. Easier to carry more ammo.
The 4-10 through 12 Gauge offers large knock down power with slugs, and spread pastern effectiveness with shot shells. There is a wide variety of ammunition available for the 4-10, and it's available in all 50 states, and most of the world.
The .22 cal. rifle barrel allows pinpoint accuracy, and the advantage of much more ammunition storage in the same space.
The relatively short barrels allow for easy storage, and ease of use in even the thickest underbrush.
BEST CONCEALED CARRY FIREARM.
Hammerless or concealed hammer revolver in .38 special.
Black or dark blue, never chrome, nickel or stainless steel unless you paint it flat black.
The 5 shot detective's model is very good if you can find the concealed hammer version.
Don't go for fancy sights, or large hammers or anything sticking out on the piece.
All of that is just something else to get caught on your clothing, ect.
I don't recommend semi-automatics for concealed carry for the average citizen.
If they have to be fired under a jacket, or in a pocket, semi-autos have a tendency to jam.
Large volume guns are not recommended, because most close range shootings consist of only one aimed shot anyway.
.38, .38 special, .38 special Plus P, .357 mag. are all good concealed carry revolvers.
.38 Special will punch through everything a would-be assailant would wear save a small arms resistant vest. Street punks don't wear body armor, but they do wear leather jackets with god knows what in the pockets, and layers of sweat shirts.
I've seen cases of .25 auto, .32 cal., .380 and even 9MM rounds being stopped by heavy leather jackets.
A .38 special or better WILL reach it's target.
BEST ALL AROUND HAND GUN.
The Ruger Six Shooter, (GP Series!! GP stands for General Purpose, like your Jeep).
Good adjustable sites, good grips, large handle, 4" or 6" barrel make for being able to hit the target, reasonable size cylinder release, really good safety features and a muzzle design that isn't damaged beyond repair the first time it's dropped on the ground.
(all guns that are used get dropped sooner or later, it's just a fact of life)
Everybody makes something for them, and Ruger has one of the best warranties in the business.
.357 mag is a good all around cartage. Good for hunting, and .38 specials can be fired out of it when you are just doing target practice.
Stainless steel construction makes it virtually impervious to sweat and weather.
BEST SEMI-AUTO HANDGUN.
The Taurus PT-92, 99, 101.
Built in Brazil on machines from Barretta.
Barretta parts will interchange for the most part.
The older style PT-92 with no de-cock is my first choice, but may not be available everywhere anymore.
NEVER TRUST A DE-COCK!!
I've seen dozens of accidental firings because somebody was foolish enough to think that a de-cock was safe!!
Always let the hammer down by hand, by putting your thumb in between the hammer and the slide.
Taurus has a lifetime warranty, and they stand by it. It takes a while to get your firearm back, but usually, they send you a new firearm instead of repairing the old one, or give you lots of new parts on your old frame.
The PT-92 is almost identical to the Barretta 92, with a few important differences...
1. Taurus is $300 cheaper and has a lifetime warranty.
2. Taurus will fire with the magazine out.
3. Taurus safety goes the correct direction, down to fire.
4. Taurus with out de-cock can be carried 'Cocked and locked', meaning the hammer cocked, and the safety on. Barretta will de-cock when the safety is put on.
5. If you file on, or change to a Barretta magazine catch, you can use Taurus or Barretta magazines. Barretta magazine catches will interchange with Taurus magazine catches.
6. Any specialty barrel made for a Barretta will fit right into a Taurus. so will the barrel locks, springs, slides, grips, ect...
If you decide to buy a Taurus or Barretta for target practice, make sure you get the good adjustable rear sight, instead of the minimal 'combat' type sight.
I can't imagine why anyone would want to use a semi-auto for target practice... Unless you were going to try for one of those silly cop style rapid fire matches where you plan to miss lot.
MOST FUN FIREARMS...
Muzzle loading!!!
Love those black powder guns!!
Low pitch roar instead of brain sucking high pitched crack...
The smoke! The smell of the cordite, the gun bucking in your hands...
The fact that in most states, you don't need any permits to own or carry muzzle loading pistols....
Yes, in most states, you can carry a loaded muzzle loading pistol with out permits legally.
I find it real fun to mold my own balls, and sometimes even make my own black powder.
I'm still working on making a reliable cap...
Flint locks are a ball of fun too, but they can be a real pain in the butt to find parts for.
If you don't enjoy taking your guns apart and cleaning them, I recommend you take up another hobby!! Black powder is corrosive, and the guns must be cleaned very thoroughly immediately after you are done firing them.
They will rust and corrode into junk in just a day or two of you are not careful.
BEST LONG RANGE HUNTING RIFLE.
The Remington 700 ADL/ BLD platform.
Available in may calibers, and in long bolt or short bolt configuration.
Get the synthetic stock if you plan to hunt with the rifle, it's more accurate, and stands up to knocks and scrapes much better.
Very accurate from the factory, everybody makes something for them, and they are very reliable.
Reasonably priced, and available everywhere, and no state restrictions on bolt action rifles.
BEST TARGET FIREARM.
Ruger 10-22, .22 Cal. long rifle.
It's the best plinking and target firearm around.
Tough, reliable, cost effective, available everywhere, and everybody makes something for them.
.22 won't break your budget, shoulder, or your ear drums to shoot all afternoon.
It's a rim fire rifle, so it's not going to be on the ban list just yet...
BEST RECLUSIVE "NUT-JOB" GUNS...
If you are ready to move into with the Weavers in Idaho, or Move to a compound in Waco, your best bet is to stay in groupings... So you don't have to stock tons of parts for twenty kinds of firearms and 20 different calibers of ammunition.
For a closed compound, quantity of ammunition is more important than the types of firearms, but types of fire arms are second on the list, then comes spare parts.
=====================
Self reliance is an art, practiced by intelligent people, not jumped into to by alarmist paranoids for fear of the unknown.
That extends to food and water, medical supplies and know how, and mechanical intelligence is more important than stock piling firearms and ammo.
You must make allowances for a good pantry, food, spices like salt and canning supplies, and a good stock pile of medical supplies and living goods, like soaps and toothpaste.
Seeds for a garden are a must for long term self reliance. A green house or hot beds would be a good idea also.
Health care is important, all the guns in the world won't do you any good if you have an abscessed tooth or infected cut, or have nothing to eat or drink.
Prepare for a natural disaster first, flood, earthquake, tornado or hurricane, then worry about the government, ours or some other country...
=====================
If you choose the 7.62 X 39 MM caliber, then stay with the SKS or AK-47 Knock offs.
They are cheap, available almost everywhere, and magazines are very available.
Ammo is dirt cheap, but usually not reloadable.
Chinese imports can some times be undependable.
If you choose the 7.62 X 51 MM (match .308 cal.), then stay with the M-14, the FN-FAL, or the HK-91/ G-3 platforms.
Civilian platforms include the remington pump and semi-auto versions, (76 and 760, I think..?)
Magazine fed, semi-auto, and available but expensive.
Not really good for hunting or target practice, but might make you feel better if things take a turn for the worst.
Ammo is available in both military surplus and civilian markets, most types are reloadable.
This is the larger NATO chambering, so ammo will always be available.
The AR-15 can also be chambered for 7.62 X 39 MM very easily, and is a very reliable.
If you choose the 5.56 X 45 MM (Rem. .223) The Colt AR-15 is the obvious choice.
The AR-15 is the civilian version of the US military M-16, and comes in about three hundred different variations. Everybody makes something for them, and parts and magazines are everywhere. Very simple platform to work with.
There is also the civilian Ruger Mini-14. It's very reliable, comes with inherent reliability, and is a top quality firearm. Available almost anywhere.
Almost all 5.56 MM chambered firearms are semi-automatic, and magazine fed.
There are several variations of the AR-15 made by dozens, if not hundreds of manufactures.
The AR-15 has been used by civilian and military markets, and has been chambered in everything from .22 rifle to .308 cal.
Common variations are, .22 long rifle, 9MM, .223 cal, 7.62 X 39MM, .45 Auto., all using the same basic platform, just changing magazines, bolts and barrels.
They came as pistols, as folding stock short barrel assault rifles, as long barrel rifles, and as sniper rifles.
There is even a top end made that will convert the rifle to belt feed for sustained rates of fire.
If your choice is the 9 X 19 MM platform... (common 9MM)
You will need two basic types of firearms.
Compact side arm type handguns, and the larger high volume type 'carbine' style rifle.
Good choices would be the Browning Hi-Power, Barretta/ Taurus, or the Glock in 9MM, and the AR-15, UZI or MAC type rifle. The Marlin camp carbine in 9MM would be a good choice also, without running into the ban rules.
KEEP THE LONG BARRELS.
9MM has no real range, so you will need all the barrel you can get.
9MM ammo is plentiful and cheap, and is the current NATO standard, so it's available in surplus.
If your choice is the .45 Auto platform...
Same thing as the 9MM advice...
Compact side arm, like the Colt model 1911 in .45 auto and the Thompson, AR-15 or MAC style carbine style rifles.
AGAIN, KEEP THE LONG BARRELS.
.45 has no real range, so you will need all the barrel you can get.
.45 auto ammo is plentiful, but not nearly as cheap as it used to be.
The US military still uses it, but surplus ammo is scarce these days.
---------------------------------
The best all around choice is the 12 gauge pump shotgun.
It does more cheaper than any other firearm. Ammo and custom parts are everywhere, and there is no more hard hitting firearm than the 12 ga. pump shot gun.
The second choice is the AR-15 rifle platform.
The AR-15 choices seem to be endless.
I've seen them adapted to fire everything from paint balls to 4-10 ga. shot gun shells.
They are common in .22 long rifle, 9MM and .223 cal.
Everybody makes something for them, and ammo and parts are everywhere.
Simple and quick to maintain and modify.
----------------------------------
I do not advocate doing anything illegal.
We live in a country that is ruled by law, and no one, no matter what their intentions are, should break the law.
If you really must own a full auto, or a 'chopped' firearm of some kind, then get the proper licensing for it.
Any US citizen that hasn't had a felony conviction or mental illness can legally own a fully automatic firearm. I urge you to obtain that certification if you wish to possess a full auto firearm.
If you want to 'Experiment' with firearms, get a Class II Manufacturers' License and have at it. That will make most things legal, and you will be able to register it with ATF after you make something tricky.
I do not advocate carrying or using a hand gun unless it's properly registered and licensed.
Handguns have little or no use outside if target shooting or hunting.
A readily available handgun can turn a minor altercation into a major tragedy really quickly, so I urge everyone that wants to carry a handgun to get the proper license and training.
Training is essential for safe operation, even for police and military, the difference being, the police and military recognize that fact, and many civilians don't.
"I Have The Body Of A God... Buddha"
