Off Roading Forums banner
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
G

·
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok this isn't about a jeepster. I mentioned on Hercs post,One more jeep cant hurt! I said I found a scrambler CJ8 for sale. Well I bought it for $2500 and in good shape. I thought it was a great find so I halledt home and pull out the title and it says its a 79 cj7. So I checked the VIN # on the scrambler and it doesn't match, UH OH! So I call the guy at the little shiat whole dealer and he says he will take care of it. I waited a few hours and called him back and he started getting an attitude with me, so I call my brother inlaw who is a prosecuter and he is dealing with that!Heres where I need your help! We ran the VIN and we cant find anything on it. I mean nothing. How do I break dow the VIN #, I dont even know what year it is. All I know is that they were made from 81-86. The VIN number search says you have to have 17 digits and all I come with is 14. Can someone tell me how Jeep vin# work.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
420 Posts
G

·
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for the help but it didn't work. My VIN just didn't work on that chart for some reason. I even tried to go back to 1980 and that didnt help either.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,066 Posts
I work for the sheriffs department and all you have to do is call the state police barracks near you. Tell them you're looking into buying that vehicle and something seems fishy. Give them the vin# you have and they will run it for you to see if its legit. Hope this helps!

Bill

Sprungover`71 Jeepster w/lotsa goodies
http://www.paragonap.com
http://www.geocities.com/billm18641/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,090 Posts
1975 - 1980 had 13 place serial code
1) J - Jeep Corp.
2) year code starts with 5=1975, 6=1976, etc thru 0=1980
3) trans. A= auto, F= 3 speed, M = 4 speed
4 & 5) Model code 83 = CJ-5, 84 = CJ-6, 93= CJ-7
6) GVW A = 3750 lbs., E = 4150 lbs.
7) engine code A = 258 1bbl, C=258 2bbl, E = 232 1bbl, H =304 2bbl
8 -13) Sequential #

John B.
Eastern Chapter Coordinator
Proud '72 "Bullnose" Driver
69,71 Commando Projects
50 Willys Jeepster
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,815 Posts
Just shows what happens when you don't check the paperwork against the numbers actually on the vehicle itself.
Even car dealers get caught up in it, and they supposedly know better.
Last year I looked at an Astro Van. The price was really good, seemed almost too good. He didn't want to let me compare paperwork to vin stamp, he made several excuses/diversions trying to stop me. I wrote the vehicle's number on a scrap paper - he didn't notice I did it. Later in his house he showed me the title. They didn't match, not even close. He didn't know I compared them.
I left without buying, -- he wouldn't accept my personal check - I wouldn't have given it anyway - I'd told him I would go to the bank for the cash.
I returned a couple of hours later with a detective.
Last I saw they had him in cuffs and the van on a flatbed. They found 2 other cars there with the same problem.

The typical ploy - they sell you the car, you take it home. Later on they just come visit your home and drive it away. You call the police to report it. The car you report is already stolen, or junked. The car you "had" is legally theirs, you can't prove that was the one you bought.

There's lots of ways to phoney the titles, it can't always be found out in time, but ALWAYS LOOK!





98% is Understanding it
"Don't Fix Unless Broke"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,110 Posts
That reminds me Bill, That tubs gonna have an "R" title. I'll get back to you on when (looks like a couple months, hopfully beginig of fall, may be sooner)

Bobster
o O||||O o
71 Jeepster "Soft Top" Wagon (mangled)
71 "Partster" wagon (donor)
70 Jeepster Half Cab
01 Wrangler
56 F-100 Street Rod
 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Ok this is getting even better now. The VIN on the firewall comes back to a 76 cj7, going by the VIN decoding process,Could this be wrong. Does anyone know where to look on the frame for VIN numbers. The VIN on the firewall has 13 digits so I need to look on the frame. I looked at a scrambler web page and they say all scramblers had a 17 digit VIN

 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
My dad is a police officer and he ran a 50 state check and the VIN on the firewall came back as Invalid, what ever that means. My friend just stopped by on his way to work. He has been in the body shop feild for about 15 years and looked at the VIN tag and says it has not been touched. He said you can tell by looking at the back side of the rivits. He said he has seen a lot that been changed and says if someone changed it they are freakin good. I got one more person to check it. My stepp granfather was busted about 15-20 years ago for chopping big trucks, he should know if the VIN's have been tampered with. I geuss if they have I will take it back and get my money and let the dealer take care of it. I just dont want to give it up for this price if I can get a clean title on it because I know I will never find one in this shape for this price. Im talkin no floor rust at all. Just needs the front fenders replaced, looks like it was used to push cows around the hey feilds. Thanks for the help! Oh by the way I did call my local sheriff dept. and they could only tell me is, it has never been titled in my state. Its suppose to have come out of Iowa or somewhere up that way, but I cant see that with it having no floor rust, Im thinking it came out of the mid west.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,120 Posts
this may sound a little *******, but if the title matches the vin plate, and its not stolen, go with it. also its not inconceivable that jeep might have screwed up somewhere. i mean the LSD freak that designed pacers and commandos might have been in charge of vin tags that day.

toad
3-72' commando wagons
72' half-cab
01' f-250 4x4, super cab, longbed, V-10
artic cat 300 4x4
01' kawasaki KLX 300R
92' kawasaki X-2
 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thats the problem, the title doesn't match the VIN. If it did I would be driving it instead of complaining about it. I want to make sure the numbers on the frame dont come up as stolen before I do something like that. I have looked in the typical places but no numbers. Oh hell I realy dont know what the typical places are on a jeep. I was truely hoping it was a screw up from when jeep went from a 13 digit VIN to a 17 VIN. That happened from 1980 to 1981 and the scrambler came out in 81. I was hoping it was something like the end of the year production in 1980 and lets call it it an 81, you know what I mean!


 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,815 Posts
How 'bout enlisting the help of the dealer where you bought it? If he's legit he'll bend over backwards to straighten it out. He's the one that committed fraud and possible GTA by selling it to you. You don't have to take it back to him - yet. Call him, tell him the problem. Don't give him much time to respond, he'll possibly try to stall you, hoping you'll get creative or stop caring.
You might ask him whether he wants you to go to the DA or get it squared away himself? Give him only those 2 choices.
If he gives you a song and dance, file charges - he'll suddenly get interested.
He bought it in the first place, he should have checked the vehicle against the paperwork. If he wants it back, you can probably get him to buy it back for several times what you paid for it. What is his business worth to him? He could lose his dealers license over it, and possibly face criminal charges.

A friend a few years ago ordered a new Blazer from a Chevy dealer - he wanted certain options that weren't common. He waited 6 weeks for it to come in. They called him that it was ready.
The next day he went to pick it up. He found out they sold it from under him. He had to order another one. He found out who bought it, the guy paid $2000 extra for it. He called the guy and told him it was supposed to be his. Turned out the buyer was an assistant DA, and very interested. He'd just walked in and bought it on the spot. That was illegal to sell someone else's vehicle that had been ordered like that.
The asst DA called the dealership. End result was the dealer suddenly produced another Blazer with all the goodies you can imagine on it - including the options my friend wanted. The value was about 10,000 more than was ordered - at no charge. They appologized instead of putting their license in jeapardy.

You've got the leverage here, use it!

98% is Understanding it
"Don't Fix Unless Broke"
 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I talked to the dealer and he said bring it back and he will refund me my money. My brother inlaw is a DA and allready talked to him so he is whilling to work it out. I just want to make sure I cant get a title first because if I take it back and he gets a title the price will go up. He thought it was a cj7 so thats what he had it priced to sale as. Now he knows its a CJ8 and has a higher resale. This leaves me with getting the numbers off the frame so I can see what the scoop is. We found the guy who traded it in and he is the one that said it came from up north.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,815 Posts
I wouldn't take it back to him, squeeze him hard, he's the one who commited the crime by stupidity.
He dropped the price because he knew he had a problem, but tried to screw you! He thought you were dumb.
Keep it, get your money back, and a clean title or turn him in!
He's got insurance for that sort of thing anyway.

Give no quarter.



 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
That sounds like a plan. My brother inlaw the D.A. says the highpo will take the jeep if we do that. I just got off the phone with a guy that does inspections for the state on rebuilt cars and he says there is no number on the frame that they can check. I said there has to be and he said on those year models they dont check the frame. He said as long as the title matches the VIN tag on the firewall thats what they go by. My buddie has an old junked out 79 CJ7 with a title and VIN plate that I can swapp. Just havent got the balls to do it. Its obvious some one got away with it for a long time. Then I came along!

 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You might try going through a title service. They usualy charge around 100 bucks to get a clean title. Just fill out the form as a CJ8 with the numbers on the firewall as the VIN, using the year from the VIN. I would only do this if you are going to keep the jeep and not try to sell it any time soon. I have a old BSA bike and the numbers are all screwed up on it, but I will probably ride it till it dies, so I am not to worried about it. The frame numbes match the title even though if you try to look the numbers up in a book they do not make any sence. good luck

Karl Von Kologiski
67 Jeepster Half Cab
99 Jeep Cherokee
A garage full of old British & Italian Motorcycles
 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I appreciate the help and advice but I think we got it figured out. Have any of you guys herd of a bond title. I have to to put a small portion of money and the state gives me, basicly an insured title. Its so if something comes up later down the road it covers my @ss and they go after the last person that had that VIN in there name. I thought it was going to be alot of money but it something like $20 to every $1000 that the vehiche is worth. I think I should go back to the dealer and have him foot the money so it keeps his @ss and reputation out of it.

 
G

·
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Just wanted to say now that I got a title in process, I geuss I can take this title they gave me and locate the other CJ7 and take it AH. Since I did pay for it and I have the title I geuss that makes it mine right. I allready located the previous owner that sold this guy the CJ7 and she said it was not a scrambler that she sold him. She said if she had a scrambler she would have kept it.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,110 Posts
The plot gets thicker...

Anything else on the lot that this "dealer" can "part with" to keep out of jail? ;o)

Bobster
o O||||O o
71 Jeepster "Soft Top" Wagon (mangled)
71 "Partster" wagon (donor)
70 Jeepster Half Cab
01 Wrangler
56 F-100 Street Rod
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
Top