Make links for 4 or 3 link rear
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I have an idea on how I want to make the links for my coil set up. I got this by looking a countless others, I in no way came up w/ this on my own I deserve no credit. I was originaly going to use turnbucles/tractor links, but then I noticed what others were doing and I thought it looked simple enough, seemed to work well and would look better when it was done.
<image src="http://tellico.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/1220244-link.bmp">
I would use one piece of tubing square or round fot the length of the link, and a piece of round tubing w/ the same inner dia as the leaf spring pack I am taking off on each end for the joints. Then I can just reuse the bushings and pins from the leafs on the links right? If this is true it brings up another question.
If I do a 3 link, that means there are 7 mounting points for links if you count both the points on the axle as well as the points on the truck frame/crossmember. For 6 of those this type of joint will allow movement in the proper plane of travel. But for the one on top of the dif it will not work. THe one on top of dif has to flex left and right not up and down. Which is the opposite plain of movement compared to the rest right? So what do I use for this? I would not mind having to put out some $$ for this one joint if the others will work properly the way I plan to make them.
All you guys with coils out there let me know what you think! I need a little help here I'm almost ready to start!
F_T
<image src="http://tellico.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/1220244-link.bmp">
I would use one piece of tubing square or round fot the length of the link, and a piece of round tubing w/ the same inner dia as the leaf spring pack I am taking off on each end for the joints. Then I can just reuse the bushings and pins from the leafs on the links right? If this is true it brings up another question.
If I do a 3 link, that means there are 7 mounting points for links if you count both the points on the axle as well as the points on the truck frame/crossmember. For 6 of those this type of joint will allow movement in the proper plane of travel. But for the one on top of the dif it will not work. THe one on top of dif has to flex left and right not up and down. Which is the opposite plain of movement compared to the rest right? So what do I use for this? I would not mind having to put out some $$ for this one joint if the others will work properly the way I plan to make them.
All you guys with coils out there let me know what you think! I need a little help here I'm almost ready to start!
F_T
heim joints...starting at 11.99 on the JEGS Racing website under rodends.
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=91923&prmenbr=361
Its the cheapest place Ive found them..
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=91923&prmenbr=361
Its the cheapest place Ive found them..
If you are going to do a wishbone with the single rod end at the top of the diff I would use a minimum of 1" or 1-1/4" would hold up better. I would use 3/4" body 5/8" at the frame and lower axle points. they are just as strong as the 3/4" full but allow more movement because of the smaller hole through diameter
Also use round tubing for your link it is stronger then square
Also use round tubing for your link it is stronger then square
What type of tubing do you recomend? In the first post I talked about making a joint for the body and lower axle mounts. I realize these joints would be better but what was wrong with the idea I had. I am NOT being defensive at all I was just wondering where my thinking went wrong on the fundamental idea. I still don't have a very good understanding of the mechanics/physics of all this coil/link stuff.
Thanks for the input, I think I'll go to the page mentioned above and price some joints.
Oh yeah do you know any where to get a bigger joint like you recomend? I do plan on doing the y link on top. Or at least I think I am don't realy understand the difs in the y on top as opposed to a 4 link ither
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. Made a post about it, no one answered.
Thanks for the input, I think I'll go to the page mentioned above and price some joints.
Oh yeah do you know any where to get a bigger joint like you recomend? I do plan on doing the y link on top. Or at least I think I am don't realy understand the difs in the y on top as opposed to a 4 link ither
Well, for tubing its preference and driving terrain You want allot more beef in the rocks, then you would say if you were mud bogging. I have seen 1-3/8" DOM 1/4" wall. and I have seen as large as 1-3/4" HREW. an example would be my links and the ones I have done lately have been 1.5 od .120 wall sleeved with 1.75 .120
and then done the same way your pic at top was using standard rubber bushings at the axle side to help absorb shock load. Then at the frame I used xmt 10 rod ends for better movement. the debate on rod end vs. bushing will never stop. the other alternative and expensive aproach is a johny joint..It has the overall beef and size of a bushing but has the flex of a rod end. Rod ends do have to be replaced they do wear out bushings you dont and JJ's are rebuildable.
IF i were to go with a wishbone on the top I would use a solid bushing at the frame ( it only has too move up and down) on the top of the axle I would use a JJ then for the lowers frame side rod ends and the lower axle bushing.
There are many different link desighns all that achieve basically the same outcome they are based on the amout of room you have to place your links. One way to simply think about it is your lowers determine axle location(for wheel base ) the uppers do the same if set horrizontaly parallel to loweres but then you also need a trac bar to locate the axle side to side. So if you take lower link and mount it with a slight pitch towards the center of the rig and you uppers come off the top of the diff and triangulate above them you dont ned to use a trac bar. The triangulation is what laocates the axle. In a 3 link loweres are parralel to the frame one upper goes from the axle to the lower mid section and you need a trac-bar to locate isde to side movement. In a wish bone stlye it is just that the uppers wishbone locates the axle from side to side. and the lowers locate the wheellbase there are pros and cons to every setup and there is NO perfect setup. Now give me a little while to have my coffee and i will comment on your CG question I hope this made sence and there is nothing wrong with your thinking, I just would not use square tube.
and then done the same way your pic at top was using standard rubber bushings at the axle side to help absorb shock load. Then at the frame I used xmt 10 rod ends for better movement. the debate on rod end vs. bushing will never stop. the other alternative and expensive aproach is a johny joint..It has the overall beef and size of a bushing but has the flex of a rod end. Rod ends do have to be replaced they do wear out bushings you dont and JJ's are rebuildable.
IF i were to go with a wishbone on the top I would use a solid bushing at the frame ( it only has too move up and down) on the top of the axle I would use a JJ then for the lowers frame side rod ends and the lower axle bushing.
There are many different link desighns all that achieve basically the same outcome they are based on the amout of room you have to place your links. One way to simply think about it is your lowers determine axle location(for wheel base ) the uppers do the same if set horrizontaly parallel to loweres but then you also need a trac bar to locate the axle side to side. So if you take lower link and mount it with a slight pitch towards the center of the rig and you uppers come off the top of the diff and triangulate above them you dont ned to use a trac bar. The triangulation is what laocates the axle. In a 3 link loweres are parralel to the frame one upper goes from the axle to the lower mid section and you need a trac-bar to locate isde to side movement. In a wish bone stlye it is just that the uppers wishbone locates the axle from side to side. and the lowers locate the wheellbase there are pros and cons to every setup and there is NO perfect setup. Now give me a little while to have my coffee and i will comment on your CG question I hope this made sence and there is nothing wrong with your thinking, I just would not use square tube.
<image src="http://tellico.off-road.com/wwwthreads_uploads/1220726-linkquestion.bmp">
Please pretend the dif is centered and the wishbone is simetrical.
Ok so I can use my homeade joints for points 2 and 3.
and use heim joints like the ones on the above suggested page for the rest 3/4" for all thread size. 5/8" (bolt size) on points 5 and 7. and 3/4" (bolt size) on points 1 and 4. The only acception is point 6 where I want something bigger like a 1 1/4 or so, right?
Now on anlgeing the links. I will ask these questions from the point of view from behind the truck like the pic is drawn from. So if I understand your last post I should mount the lower links in a way that the frame mounts could be on the bottom of the rails and widen a little before connecting to the axle? The wishbone then would then mount to the frame on an internal crossmsmber and to the axle in the center top of the 3rd? As the relation of points 1234 do they need to be in the same horizontal plane ro ofset like in the pic or what?
Now question while point of view on side of the truck.
These questions deal with length of links and horizontal angles. As I understand it the bottom ones are longer, depending on like you said wheelbase. So this is a kind of "it depends" kind of issue as far as length goes. But I want them to be long enough to be somewhat horizontal in relation to the frame right? Now as far as the leght of the wishbone structure goes is there a % it should be in relation to the length of the lower links? I only ask because I can put the crossmember in at whatever distance I need it to be to achieve stability.
I know this is a lot
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, thanks a million. This will be so much more fun to do myself than buying a kit!
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Please pretend the dif is centered and the wishbone is simetrical.
Ok so I can use my homeade joints for points 2 and 3.
and use heim joints like the ones on the above suggested page for the rest 3/4" for all thread size. 5/8" (bolt size) on points 5 and 7. and 3/4" (bolt size) on points 1 and 4. The only acception is point 6 where I want something bigger like a 1 1/4 or so, right?
Now on anlgeing the links. I will ask these questions from the point of view from behind the truck like the pic is drawn from. So if I understand your last post I should mount the lower links in a way that the frame mounts could be on the bottom of the rails and widen a little before connecting to the axle? The wishbone then would then mount to the frame on an internal crossmsmber and to the axle in the center top of the 3rd? As the relation of points 1234 do they need to be in the same horizontal plane ro ofset like in the pic or what?
Now question while point of view on side of the truck.
These questions deal with length of links and horizontal angles. As I understand it the bottom ones are longer, depending on like you said wheelbase. So this is a kind of "it depends" kind of issue as far as length goes. But I want them to be long enough to be somewhat horizontal in relation to the frame right? Now as far as the leght of the wishbone structure goes is there a % it should be in relation to the length of the lower links? I only ask because I can put the crossmember in at whatever distance I need it to be to achieve stability.
I know this is a lot
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IF you are going with a wishbone your lowers do not have to angle to the frame they can be a straight shot. Because your wishbone is your centering pivot. from the side view you want lowers links as parrallel to the ground as possable. and your wishbone will depend on the seperation at axle and frame. rule of thumb uppers are 75% of lowers in length .. everything else is a crap shoot based on where you can mount and how.. Like i said there is no perfect setup just general rules. I dont recall what the seperation from axle to frame height should be... I will see if I can come up with it
Hmmm, interesting - 79% of the lower link.
I know it's common practice, even TJ's suspension is that way - but -
Makes me wonder - as the axle swings down the, shorter arc of the top arm pulls the top of the axle forward (in a rear axle application), thus rotating the pinion downward, away from the trans, making more U-joint angle.
I never really thought of it in those terms before - seems backwards.
I know it's common practice, even TJ's suspension is that way - but -
Makes me wonder - as the axle swings down the, shorter arc of the top arm pulls the top of the axle forward (in a rear axle application), thus rotating the pinion downward, away from the trans, making more U-joint angle.
I never really thought of it in those terms before - seems backwards.
I understood everything you said here accept
"I dont recall what the seperation from axle to frame height should be... I will see if I can come up with it
"
What height are we talking about here? The verticle difference between the mounting points 6 and 2 and 3? If so I get it. And to clerify from before I am suposed to use my homeade joints on the axle for the lowers?
F_T
"I dont recall what the seperation from axle to frame height should be... I will see if I can come up with it
"
What height are we talking about here? The verticle difference between the mounting points 6 and 2 and 3? If so I get it. And to clerify from before I am suposed to use my homeade joints on the axle for the lowers?
F_T
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