NEWS PARTS JEEP & 4x4 ATV & UTV

Lets here some opinions on rear axles

1208 Views 33 Replies 6 Participants Last post by **DONOTDELETE**, May 12, 2000

G

Discussion Starter · May 3, 2000

Which axle do you think is the best for the rear axle a Dana 44 or Dana 60? Here is the criteria for the Jeep. A small block V8 (350 or 360) 35/12.5 MT tires, granny tranny (NP435 T18 or NV 4500), locker. The vehicle will be used for hard to serious rock crawling. The axle will need to be 58-63 inches wide so it will be out of a fullsize Jeep something. Cost is a factor. So what axle? Thanks.

Tim Springer
1980 CJ7
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G

Discussion Starter · #2 · May 3, 2000

Dana 60, nearly unbreakable, if set up properly. Steve

Mopar360yj
87yj+20,74CHR.030360,SOA,35BFGATs,46RH,241DHD,
D60-44-4.10

G

Discussion Starter · #3 · May 3, 2000

Just one question. What about a GM 14 bolt? In my opinion it is stronger then a Dana 60, and you can pick them up for under 2 bills. I am running a D44 right now. With 35 inch tires I don't think it is strong enough. No major problems yet, but it is just a matter of time. If I was staying with a 5 lug bolt pattern I guess the only choice is a D60. Just my opinion, but go with 8 lug and solve your axle breakage problems before they begin.

Thanks Ray

SonoraBob

· #4 · May 3, 2000

Go for a 60. I picked mine up for $150. Just shop around and get a good deal. Avoid junk yards and look for folks parting out vehicles. If you are going to spend the money, just spend the extra 10% and get the good stuff. You won't regret it. Especially with a V-8.

CJ-8, CJ-6, Cherokee

G

Discussion Starter · #5 · May 3, 2000

First 14 bolt is wider than my criteria and I don't want to spend the money to narrow them. Second the 14 bolt hangs down almost an inch more than a 60 which hangs down 3/4 inch of more than a 44. To run the 14 I would need 38" to compensate and I don't think anything over 35" is comfortable for on road driving. If I was building a trail only vehicle with 44" tires I would consider the 14 but not for this Jeep.

Tim Springer
1980 CJ7
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G

Discussion Starter · #6 · May 3, 2000

tim,
after many hours of banging my head against the wall i have come to the conclusion that i want to build my jeep right. thats why i am going with the dana 60. some people say its overkill for a jeep. but with what we both plan on doing, why would we want anything else?

81 cj-7,360,SOA,35's,locked rear,fullcage

G

Discussion Starter · #7 · May 3, 2000

I posted this question after talking with you about using a Dana 60 and Chris Brown using custom 63"(?) Dana 44s front and rear. Granted he is using a full floating warn kit in the rear but it got me wondering what people around the country prefer. I still hate the idea of losing 3/4 inch ground clearance and added more weigth to the Jeep with the 60 but it is probably going to be a matter of what I can get and how stupid I feel like being. Does anyone have anything good to say about a Dana 44 rear with 35" tires and a V8? Thanks.

Tim Springer
1980 CJ7
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G

Discussion Starter · #8 · May 3, 2000

hey,
i understand, it would be interesting to see other peoples ideas on the 44. browns jeep is certianly on way to do it but i couldnt spend that much money on the rear axle alone. i just was bored, thought i would reply to your post. i have definatly made up my mind on the 60...it would be interesting to see how a dna 44 holds under a v8, i have heard the do pretty good but if ya got a heavy foot you should go with the 60...somebody was telling me, i think it was that one big tall guy in the club that i should look into a 12 bolt rear..but i dunno, is there any info on the 12?

81 cj-7,360,SOA,35's,locked rear,fullcage

G

Discussion Starter · #9 · May 3, 2000

12 bolt is a C-crap i mean clip axle. From what I hear it is about the strength of a Dana 44 (might be slightly stronger) but if you break an axle kiss your wheel goodbye. You can buy a C-clip eliminator kit but that is more money. A lot of the Chevy guys that I have talked to are swapping them out for 14 bolt full floating axles. If it was Jeff that was telling you about the 12 bolt he is a little biased since he owns a Blazer.

Tim Springer
1980 CJ7
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G

Discussion Starter · #10 · May 3, 2000

Dont think 44 wont hold up, Here at home we put them to the test weekly, sure there,s a few that run 60,s but if you are geared and locked up right i wouldn,t worry. I am running 39.5 swampers with 44 scout rear, wagoneer 44 front been through helllllll and back, LIKE A TIMEX. EACH IS THERE OWN BUT 44 IS IS TOUGH

BRADCO JEEPS

338

· #11 · May 3, 2000

The Ford 8.8 is considerably stronger than a D44, smaller than a D60 only about an 1" lower than a D35 and with disc brakes it is a semi floating configuration. And the wheel would not be lost if a C clip failed. 60 1/2" wide you would need to have the hubs redrilled to accept 5 on 5 1/2 or have moser supply a set of high strength. Im kinda biased because I run one on my YJ, but they are a good axles with a beefy pinion yoke. Just another idea to toss around.

Jeff
89 Wrangler
If at first you dont succeed, your replacement will try and try again.

JEEPN

· #12 · May 3, 2000

Something you didn't mention that should be crutial to the thought process is the gearing. The lower the gearing the less contact the pinion gear has with the ring gear and the more prone to breakage there is. If you're running 4.56 or higher, the D44 should do, if 4.88's and under, definitely go with the D60. In my opinion, for what you're looking to do, get the D60 and forget it. Sure, the D44 might hold up, then again, it might not, depending on how radical you get. The D60 should definitely do the trick.

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7"Lift/33"TSL's/IHC D44's 4.10's Lock'd

G

Discussion Starter · #13 · May 4, 2000

Good point on the 14 bolt. The only reason I mentioned it is because I can not find a D60 around here for a decent price. Yes the D44 is very strong(I am running one behind a 401), but if I had to do it over I would go stronger. Being to strong is kinda like having to much horsepower.

Thanks Ray

G

Discussion Starter · #14 · May 4, 2000

Go with a 60 and you WILL not regret it, go with a 44 and you MIGHT not regret it. Dana 60 semi floaters are practically a dime a dozen out of Ford Econoline 250 vans (I must have seen a hundred of them while I was hunting for my FF 60). I'm not sure of the width though, but I believe they are slightly narrower than full size truck axles. I've got to much "sweat equity" in my (narrowed) 60 full floater to switch horses now, but if I had it all to do over again I'd go with an E-250 Dana 60. They might be a little wide full width, but if so they are WAAAAAAAY easier to narrow than a full floater.

P.S. check out my post "moab ate my Dana 44". This was with 33's

My other car is a BULLDOZER

G

Discussion Starter · #15 · May 4, 2000

The 8.8 is a c-clip just like the 12-bolt, both of which have slightly better Ring&Pinions than 44's, but about equal axle strength. This is kind of a tough one for me. 35" radials aren't all that radical, so I'm leaning toward saying "44". But, since you're starting from scratch, and will likely have to spend some $$$ on gears & lockers, a 60 done right - while overkill for 35" radials IMO - could last a long time, even after you decide 35's aren't big enough somewhere down the road. If you had a 44 now, I'd tell you to keep it & wouldn't hesitate to say so. But, since you're starting from scratch (and you did say extreme rock crawling), it might make sense just to start with a 60 - and I think a 5 on 5.5" semi-floater is the way I'd go.

TEX

/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif Got Mud?
G.U.M.B.O. Mud Racing

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CJDave

· #16 · May 4, 2000

8

/wwwthreads_images/icons/tongue.gif That term: "Semi Floater" really gets me. I see it all the time in magazine articles and on this board. Where's the "float" in a semi-floater? The axle carries weight.....what's floaty about that? In truck axles there were a couple of different types, but the one which was REALLY a true floater was the GM corporate truck axle as used in the medium duty (27,000 Lbs and under) truck for YEARS. It did not even have an axle flange, but had like a GEAR on the outboard end which slid into the inside splines on the hub assembly. A light end cap kept it from falling out. That axle floated COMPLETELY, and if the axle housing was really badly bent, NO PROBLEM, whereas if the regular bolted axle floaters got bent you couldn't keep the axle drive bolts tight. It's been a while since I had a pre-war Ford rear axle apart, but as I recall, THEY were a "true" semi floater. The brake drum had roller brgs that rode directly on the housing, and the axle kept the drum from falling off, and turned it as well of course. (Do we have a "correct" NAME for the non semi-floater axles?)/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gifThe moonguys were just wondering/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gifOh yeah!....My little suspension moonguy/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gifjust reminded me that front wheel drive cars like our GM Grand Am have full floaters in the front.....the axle carries NO weight whatsoever./wwwthreads_images/icons/smile.gif

CJDave
Quadra-Trac modified by the crack moonguy/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif/wwwthreads_images/icons/smile.gif/wwwthreads_images/icons/tongue.gif transfer case team.

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m715

· #17 · May 4, 2000

GM 12 bolt - NO
GM 14 bolt - Too heavy, a full floater weighs 600 lbs, and there is a large loss in ground clearance, however they are cheap!!! A full floater w/4.56 and a detroit is $500-550 NEW. (millitary surplus)
Dana 44 - Excellent rear even under V8 power, have seen them hold up well with 38's, can take the abuse and keep on ticking
Dana 60 - Huge Ring and pinion, just remember that the normal everyday 60 semi-float uses the same size shafts as a 44 does (30 spline, 1.3X dia). There is only a ground clearance of 3/4", but it does weigh more. Some of the early Jeep Pickups used a 60 Semi-floater rear that had 35 spline 1.5" dia shafts, and had a 5x5.5 bolt pattern, if your condisdering full width you might look for one of those beasts.

Luke
'77 CJ7 SOA, 35's, D60 rear w/detroit & narrow trac 44 shafts

338

· #18 · May 5, 2000

Ford used D60s in the rear of their standard duty F250s from the late 70s early 80s through the mid 80s. They were the 35 spline 1.5 inch axles. They were considered a semi floating axle, but they were a C clip design. They would have come with 8 lug hubs.

Jeff
89 Wrangler
If at first you dont succeed, your replacement will try and try again.

338

· #19 · May 5, 2000

Tex,
You have suggested the D60 semi floater, 5 on 5 1/2 as a good potential candidate to be swapped in for Extreme Rock Crawling. One potential problem with that axle is the inability to use a Detroit Locker. I beleive the Detroit Locker is only available for the Full floater. ARB I think, only recently started offering a locker for the Semi Floating D60. Some of the Semi Floating D60s(D60-2 versions) were also C- clip retained, (I know some Fords were, but Im not sure if they were used by other manufacturers). When I was considering using a D60 that was one of the 1st problems I encountered).
Also the 8.8 R&P are much beefier than a D44. If placed side by side there is a BIG difference in thickness and construction of the carrier, ring gear and pinion shaft(1.65"), even though there is only .3" difference in Ring gear diameter.The 3.25" axle tubes are also much more heavy Duty. Also in the Explorer versions 95 and newer, they are a semi floating design, and although they are a C-clip design, the C-clip is not the primary component for retaining the axle, those duties are passed off to a flange at the end of the tubes,disc brake mounting plate and a bearing retainer, held in place with 4 5/8 bolts. The pinion yoke is also an extremely strong design, and does not require the removal of the pinion shaft retaining nut if yoke failure were to occure.
In a rear axle application I would place the 8.8 well above the D44 or corporate 12 in reliability and strength.

Jeff
89 Wrangler
If at first you dont succeed, your replacement will try and try again.

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G

Discussion Starter · #20 · May 5, 2000

H8Monday, I think you're wrong about the 60 rear. In fact I know you are. I have a friend with a Detroit in the rear of his CJ8 mudracer. 5-lug, semi-floating 60. This was a common rear for Mopar muscle cars & is used quite a bit in drag racing.

As to the 8.8, I wasn't arguing in favor or against this, except to say that if the 12-bolt is out, so is the 8.8. Both are virtually identical in strength, and both have the exact same shortcoming (if that concerns you). I would not agree with you on placing this rear above the 12-bolt at all (good friend of mine runs a 12-bolt in the rear of his Super Stock mud racer with 650HP & 38.5 Boggers - no breakage since he put it in several years ago), & only the R&P is SLIGHTLY better than the 44 IMO. We're not going to agree on this point, so I won't argue it further.

TEX

/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif Got Mud?
G.U.M.B.O. Mud Racing

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