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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I got a raise at work this week so I gotta hurry up and spend it. /wwwthreads_images/icons/smile.gif That old tempting idea of a TJ has returned. My past attempts led to disappointment and my Tacoma due to rude and totally clueless salesmen /wwwthreads_images/icons/frown.gif. I have a few questions, first does anyone know of a good Jeep dealer in Phoenix that has salespeople who know more (or at least the same amount) about what they're selling then me? And second how hard is it to get a TJ equipted the way you want. Anytime I mention this to a dealer they just try to pedel whatever's laying around. I don't mind waiting and I know my odd ball Jeep wouldn't be sitting on any dealer's lot, assuming Jeep would even build it.
Here's what I want:
4.0 liter, non-negotiable must have
5 speed, must have. I'd like to get the 4cyl gears in it but I know that ain't gonna hapen
4wd, I think this will come in handy/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif
Dana 44 rear, non-negotiable I hate 35cs/wwwthreads_images/icons/tongue.gif yuk
4.56 gears in front end, You think Jeep would do this and save me the hassle of doing both? But would leave me with mismatched gears for a bit.
Dual tops, why are these so hard to find?
A/c and assorted other creature comforts

Has anyone purchased or attempted to get a simular Jeep? Any advice on how to get my Jeep? How hard is it to get a dana 44? Any options worth getting I've overlooked? Any stories about how much you love your TJ? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, and Happy Jeepin'
Travis

Inquire about my witty original saying contest/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif
 

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Go for it. We custom ordered OUR TJ on June 3, 1996, it arrived September 30, 1996. 4 months is a long time to wait, but it was worth every minute.

Get EVERYTHING in writing AND itemized, don't trust the salesmen (no offense to the honest ones out there), they lie like a rug.

Make sure you get a good deal. After all, they do very little work when ordering one, just punch the numbers into the computer and wait for it to arrive. Don't pay full retail price. You can find the actual ordering codes in bookstores and probably on the web, we had a printout we handed to the dealership so they didn't even have to look them up.

We got ours with 4.0, 5 speed, 30" tires and 8" rims (for the 33's later), 35C with ABS and Trac-Lok with 3.55 gears (D44 wasn't available yet), A/C (mostly due to the Heavy electrical group, but the A/C has been nice, even in Maine), dual tops (before it was an option), vinyl (easier to hose down). We also ordered the half doors and rear defroster on the hard top but were screwed out of them by the dealership. We had everything in writing and threatened to take them to court, but they said they'd cost us so much money we wouldn't be able to afford it. We wrote letters and bitched, never got the items, but they went out of business within a year, I like to think we helped.

We love our TJ. We're the last owner's it'll see and we'd buy another in a minute. It's also been the best vehicle we've owned. We went to 5 dealerships and all tried the "Just take one off the lot" route, some were so rude we brought the TJ back when it arrived to show them we could get one like we wanted. Don't settle. We also don't even notice the payments. Sure, they were huge for us at the time, but it's so enjoyable we don't notice them anymore. Good luck and get EXACTLY what you want, you'll enjoy it a whole lot more.

Do a search on buying a TJ, I know I've posted more on this subject on what to get and what not to. As to the replacing gears, I don't think they will, but give it a shot. If they replace them, they're liable and it may void the warranty (mismatched), but ask anyway. Good luck.

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7"Lift/33"TSL's/IHC D44's 4.10's Lock'd
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I was thinking maybe they could leave the front drive shaft off and that may release them from liability. In the past I ran in to problems getting the rims and tires I wanted. I want the cheapest smallest pieces of crap they got but they say in order to get the 44 I have to waste money on the big tires. My favorite 4wd shop is about 1.5 miles from Darner Jeep and it would go straight there for a gear swap in the rear. Unfortunately Darner is staffed with rude morons. Last time I was there not a single salesman drove a Jeep and not one knew what a dana 44 was. They wanted to waste an hour of my time with a "quickk credit check" before I got to see a single Jeep. Earnharts Jeep wasted 3 hours of my day and I didn't get to see a single Jeep. Not a one on the lot had a 5 speed and a dana 44. The salesman couldn't grasp the concept of taking a vehichle off the road. Next stop was Big Two Toyota, with in 3 minutes I was test driving my Tacoma, no hassles. If I had that kind of service at either Jeep dealer I'd have one right now. It's really sad, I love Jeeps and walked onto the lot knowing exactly what I wanted. It sounds like the easiest sell in the world. Oh well. I try one more time then I'm giving up.
Travis

Inquire about my witty original saying contest/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
We just bought a Durango. Picking it up tomorrow. We purchased the fleet managers demo. They gave it to us for their cost and threw in some other stuff (mud flaps, hood deflector, hitch, auto start, paint and interior treatment). If we would have bought one with zero miles they were going to give it to us for $500 over their invoice. We dealt with the fleet manager and the lease manager. We talked to the a salesman to start with but he was an idiot. We shopped around lots and new what the prices were for all the options we wanted. If you order one, the dealer gets a rebate for the interest that chrysler holds back that is charged to the dealer up front when he gets one for on the lot and doesn't sell it for a while. This is also why they try and dump the ones on the lot as well. The longer they sit the more it costs them. So when the dealer cries he's not making any money ask him if he gets this. I would never deal with anyone other than a manager that can make some decisions himself. Other wise its a waste of time! FYI the Durango is for my wife. She needs it for work. I get to have my TJ back. Ya Hoo!!

 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I wouldn't give up my TJ for anything, but I have one suggestion. Don't buy a new one. I wish I would have gotten a used one. I just looked on excite classifieds and checked some going prices and you can get a used TJ with < 30,000 miles loaded for as low as $17K without even looking hard. There was a 99 Sahara in there for $16,500. You are putting in 4.56s so obviously you're gonna be wheeling. Well for us AZ boys that means every plant you rub up against on the trail is going to scrach up the paint with is thorns or pickers or whatever so its not going to look new in a few months anyway. With the money you save you'll be able to afford all kinds of good offroad stuff. With all the people that can't afford the payments and are selling cheap on the internet, you might be able to find a d44 TJ as well. If not, with the money you save you can have a 44 or 60 put in. I just wonder every time I bang into a rock or run into a mesquitte tree that scraches my paint with its thorns why the heck that I bought new. Since I bought my Jeep in New Hampshire when I lived up there, I don't have experience with the sales guys at the Tucson Jeep dealer, Galloway. However I have taken mine in there for some warrenty work and they did some good work for me despite the mods I have made. I have heard some people give bad reviews of the guys there, but check out this story. I was out on a local trail (chiva falls, for those familiar) and I saw a stocker TJ SE out there trying to get over big rocks with those little 25x7 gocart tires. I passed him and the guy driving asked if I knew how to get back to town. Surprised I said follow me and the young lady in the passenger seat kinda smiled. I went over the last ledge that I sometimes I spin tires on with my 4.5" lift and 31s, and pointed to the by pass. Well he decided to take the hard route anyway. I stopped and got out to watch the show of tire spinning and rocks flying. Finally he gunned it and when the rear wheel caught traction it just threw the thing up in the air and somehow over the ledge. He pulled along side and I told him he was insane. I noticed the Jeep was brand new with all the little stickers in it. After some questions I found out that the lady was a sales person from Galloway Jeep and he was on a test drive! I then told the lady she was insane and hoped that the guy actually bought the thing. Don't know if she was new, or she know him, or what, but that dealership got alot of respect from me that day.

Mike

Mike
Tucson, Arizona
 

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Get the tires and rims then sell them on Ebay. There is someone buying a pair of TJ factory tow hooks for $30 plus $5.50 shipping. The 10,000 lb ones we put on, with clips, cost $6 each. Some of the stuff on Ebay is ridiculous, how can people pay twice as much for some of this stuff? You'd get a good deal on the tires and rims, guaranteed. We sold our original tires locally, with 15K on them (1/2 worn) for $150, which basically bought another BFG MT.

I know what you mean about dealerships, you have too nice of an attitide. We have learned this through 10 years of car buying. If they're nice to you, be nice back. Otherise, have a terrible attitude, be a jerk, demand items, make them fetch coffee, and keep telling them to lower the price. They turn into sweethearts then. We used to go into dealerships and be nice to the salesmen, it got us nowhere. We're so good at it now friends take us along car shopping. I'm not that good, I'll admit it, the wife is like a monster near them, makes me scared to ride home with her. She had one salesman crying (honest), made me feel bad for him. BTW, don't stop at the jeep, demand floor mats, bug guards, oil changes, and the like. The wife got down to quibbling for hours over $4 in the payment, floor mats, and a keychain. They gave in just to get her out of the shop. Oh yeah, you know how they always have to check with the manager on prices and are gone for 1/2 hour? She hunted the manager down and told him she'd deal only with him, since their people didn't have the authority to lower the price they were the wrong people to deal with.

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7"Lift/33"TSL's/IHC D44's 4.10's Lock'd
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I went in to special order a new TJ two weeks ago but there are no more Dana 44s for the 2000 model year. I thought the fleet mgr was full of it so I called three other fleet depts and heard the same story.

There are Dana 44s coming in, but you have to take what's on them. kinda sucks.

I suggest you ignore all of the sales guys on the floor and talk to the fleet manager. Know all of the options you want before hand and make an offer for what you want and see if they can find one.

this is what "internet car buying is" the only difference is the first contact is a web page instead of a person.

DRK is the code for the Dana 44. I had the fleet mgr search for TJ Sport 5spd with DRK and he found 8 in No. CA. Not much to choose from.

So, I'm back looking at used. and waiting to see what 2001 has to offer. I heard a new hardtop made out of plastic thats stronger and 23 pounds lighter.

good luck,

- Dan

99 4Runner (wifes grocery getter)
88 Bronco * FOR SALE *
Looking for a new trail rig...
 

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A guy mentioned he could get a deal on a used TJ for $17K, that's a deal?? How much are you guys paying for these brand new TJ's??

/wwwthreads_images/icons/cool.gif Big Ed
'88 YJ, 4" susp,3" body,33's,283 Chevy V8,TH350,4.11's,D30,D35c
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I'll sell you mine.

Its a 2000 Sport loaded with all options:
AC
Dual Tops
NV3550 5spd
Dana44.
and all the little stuff like tilt, cc, tinted windows

I've put a Tera 3" lift, Rancho 9000's, 33" BFG MT's, gas skid, air tube/K&N, Hand throttle and so on.

Only has 5000 miles on it. I purchased the TJ because I was building my CJ7 and needed another vehicle as a daily driver. I should have bought a truck but I admit.... I had the TJ bug.

Dont expect dealers to know jack squat. Unfortunately, Earnhardts has the largest selection and they will be your best bet to find the D44 and dual tops.

You Arizona guys need to join AZ_VJC...have a look at my webpage for the address.

LarryM
'85 CJ7, 350TBI, T19
'00 TJ, 4.0, NV3550, D44
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I guess maybe you are right, compared with other deals that can be had when buying a vehicle, getting a $20K TJ for between $15-17K that is 1-2 years old with around 15-30k miles isn't that great. I guess I was just thinking that saving the money would be worth it if you're just going to buy one new, lift the thing, buy new tires, and wheel it right away since you'd end up in a few months with a Jeep thats in the same condition and value as the used one would have been, just with 30k less miles. Even though I agree with the built not bought motto, if I was looking to get a TJ right now with the idea of lifting it and getting big tires, I'd look for one that has already had that done to it for sale since the price probably won't be much higher then a stock one of the same year and miles. I saw a 97 TJ sport with like 35K miles with a 4" procomp and BFGs on it for like $15K. With the added value (to someone looking to buy new and do the same thing) of the BFGs and the lift, I think that would be a great deal. Yeah it wouldn't be new and you wouldn't have gotten the satisfaction of doing it yourself, but you'd have a lot of extra money.

Mike
Tucson, Arizona
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I was talking to my neighbor who attends a lot of heavy equipment auctions here. (Edmonton, Canada). He said all the used 4X4 trucks that are going up for auction are being purchased by guys from the US. They told him with the exchange they are saving big $$. $1 US = $.67 Canadian. It might be something that anyone close to the boarder might want to look into.

Randy

 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Here's the New TJ I'd buy if I could find one. Invoice is 20,260 which includes 3% ( $600.00 ) dealer profit built into it. I've seen $100 over invoice advertised, so I planned to offer 200 under for starters...

Given the 2000 TJ has the NVG 3550, the new ignition system and its *new* it sure makes it hard a consider a used one for 17K...

Here's my cost breakdown: Only variable I've found is the current "base invoice price"

2000 sport 5spd (TJJH77) 16,898 (base invoice)
Destination charges 535
25D package 446 (Console, fulsize spare, tilt. lthr wheel, intrmt wipers...)
Air Cond (HAA) 761 -- includes HD elec
CA emissions (NAE) 0
Dana 44 (DRK) 506 -- includes tracloc
Cloth seats (K5AZ) 128
Black hardtop (VKX) 642
Deep tint glass (GCD) 344 includes defroster and wiper


99 4Runner (wifes grocery getter)
88 Bronco * FOR SALE *
Looking for a new trail rig...
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Heya,

Check out www.chrysler4less.com as soon as possible .. my buddy John and I wrote up the site. He is incharge of Internet Shopping at one of the local Chrysler/Jeep/Dodge shops here. John is not only a sales guy, he is the ultimate JeepGuy! John owns 2 Willys, CJ7, J-10 and a Cherokee! You gotta see the J-10 .. it looks like it just rolled outta the showroom, and smells like it too!

The CJ7 has full width D44's, a Jeep V8, SuperSwamper 38.5" tires and all the goodies! If you want a Jeep, talk to him, he has all the RIGHT sales answers!

Laters!

Vance - Calgary, Alberta, Canada
1985 4x4 S-10 and 1988 Jeep YJ
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Larry,
That sounds intersring if you're serious. I have a 99 fully loaded tacoma 4x4 interested in some sort of a trade? I live in the east valley And would like to discuss this further if you're interested. Check your private box for my phone #. If you're not interested in trading how much do you want for your Jeep?
Travis

Inquire about my witty original saying contest/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif
 
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