[Guest]

I'am putting together all the parts for my narrowed 44 wagoner on a 1979 CJ-7 and was wondering the best way to go for the tie rod and drag link. Should I get the rods off a wagoner and cut and tap threads to fit my Jeep or go to an after market set up. I'am still spring under for now till I find a need to go over.

 

[Jim_Lou]

Bill, I'm right with you. I'm putting a narrowed Cherokee SUA under my '78. I got Dodge outers for the flat-tops and brakes. Yesterday I shipped the shafts to Moser. Today I'm welding the spring perch and starting the axel swap.

I'm not going to make any firm plans until the axel is in there and I can see how stuff lines up. Two approaches I'm thinking about are:

Machine the top of the pass-side knuckle and bolt an arm to it for the drag link.

Weld a socket onto the pass-side steering arm for the drag link. I have a Dodge tie rod that I'd like to use, but I'm afraid it might interfere with the pitman arm.

What are you thinking?

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.

 

[338]

I dont know how to make this site address clicky, but here is the local for almost any D44 steering idea available.
http://billavista.tripod.com/Steering/Research/steeringresearch.html

I said almost, every steering option available, because I am nearly complete with a new set up, that I have only seen on one other rig, and that was the guy who designed the arms.
Here is a pic from last night. I still have my original high steer linkage hooked up to it, because I needed to be able to drive it today. The new linkage will abandon the tie rod linkage on the driver side shown. The Tie rod linkage will be connected to the right and left at the rear arms,behind the diff, the hydraulic ram will also be repositioned to attach to the tie rod behind the diff. The drag link will run from the pit man to the passenger front arm. Drag link will be 1 3/8" solid rod, the tie rod link will be 1 1/2" solid rod. Both tapped to except the 7/8" threaded 1 ton TRE's. I have had good results with the soild rod linkage(shown in the picture), for several years.
The new linkages will be completed today, so the whole assembly should be complete this evening.
Here are a couple of bics.
(the brake mounting brackets had to be clocked 30 degrees rearward to make room for the callipers on the 8 lug rotors).

here is a pic of Erics set up, nearly completed.

Jeff
89 YJ
(sensibly altered for occasional off road use)
Vision without Action, is a Daydream. Action without Vision is a Nightmare.

 

[pbmcauliffe]

http://billavista.tripod.com/Steering/Research/steeringresearch.html

pbm
There is a difference between being Educated and Intelligent!

 

[Jim_Lou]

Thnks for the information. That's a beautiful setup, and one of the options I have in mind. I am going to file these pics in my Jeep folder.

Did you make tapered holes for the tie rod ends and the bolts that hold the arms to the knuckles? If so, how did you do the taper - tapered reamer? What angle?

Since I'm building an SUA I don't think there'll be room for the tie rod up on top. If I use the flattop, the arm will probably have to bend down a couple of inches to get under everything. Then again, maybe not. By this time tomorrow I hope to know what's possible.

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.

 

[Jim_Lou]

Bill, I still don't have the axel in the Jeep, but I am leaning toward using the D30 knuckles. All steering problems look like they'll go away, except that the tie rod might interfere with the larger diff cover plate at full lock. If it does I will see what can be done about it after the parts are in place. High steer is definitely not feasible with the SUA; the tie rod would have to pass through the frame.

If I can make brakes work with what I have, I'll use the Dodge D44 spindle, hub and stub axel. Otherwise I'll put all of the old stuff back on until something breaks.

How is your project coming?

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.

 

[jeepgod]

sua.. you should be able to keep the steering stock.. except for shortening it.. for my wagoneer axle.. with the high steer.. the hi steer arms moved the tie rod holes inboard enough the stock tie rod would not work.. so...
i i kept the drag link stock.. (it bolts to the tie rod).. and i shortened the tie by cutting off the solid tie rod end.. then ground it down so an adjuster sleeve would fit over.. welded the adjuster sleeve to it.. and then clamped for double protection.. and put the short tie rod end (drivers side) into that sleeve.. works great..
i did this to keep everything that i could stock.. i cut the long (passenger side) tie rod end off.. since it was the most expensive part in the whole steering setup..
now.. i do not know how much you shortened your axle by.. but i cut my tie rod down about 3"..

jim?
why are you thinking of the d30 knuckles on that waggy axle? what year is the waggy axle?

http://www.jeepgod.net

If you are allergic to lead, it is best to avoid a war zone

 

[Guest]

The Jeep axles are comeing along pretty good. I picked up a tie rod and drag link off another 1976 Wagoner the other day. I guess I'll shorten that set up. I picked up the tie rod and drag link because some one told me the tie rod ends are bigger on the 44 knuckles. Is that true? Well anyway I have them now. All I need is some time to set the gears up and order me an air locker for the front. I found a place where you can buy one for $575 and shipping.

 

[jeepgod]

yes the tapered ends are bigger on the d44 than the d30.. they are actually the same size as one tons.. only difference is the actual size of the threaded portion.. (or tie rod itself)... but the tapered ends are the same..

http://www.jeepgod.net

If you are allergic to lead, it is best to avoid a war zone

 

[Jim_Lou]

If I use the D30 knuckles I can use the stock tie rod and drag link. I have the knuckles from the '89 Cherokee the axel came from, and I also have a set of flat top knuckles from an '84 Dodge Ramcharger. Of course, those knuckles have only one rod-end hole in the passenger side, so there's no place to connect the drag link.

I had considered bolting an arm to the top of the Dodge knuckle to attach the drag link. I also thought about welding an eye to the arm on the pass-side knuckle, but either way looks like more work for no significant advantage. Also a tie rod on those longer arms looks like it would clang on the pitman arm. Besides I can't see myself breaking the D30 knuckle with 31" donuts.

FYI, I shortened the pass side 2" and the driver side 7 1/2" to match the stock width.

Does this sound reasonable?

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.

 

[jeepgod]

jim.. im thinking if this were myself.. i would use the stock d44 everything.. shorten it..
you are doing sua right?
and then just make some custom rods for it.. you said the cherokee has just one hole in each knuckle.. well.. then you could just bolt the drag link to the tie rod.. for the tie rod.. use solid round stock.. machine down the ends.. thread them for the adjuster sleeves.. and use d44 stub tie rod ends.. have the portion for the drag link machine flat.. and reamed with a tapered hole...

you could probably modify the stock setup.. but i would have to really look at it.. since you cut your axle down so far.. you cut it down.. on both ends.. and just have them threaded.. or machined smooth and press the adjuster sleeves on.. and weld them.. but im sure you could do it.. you would also probably want to cut the drag link down also..

http://www.jeepgod.net

If you are allergic to lead, it is best to avoid a war zone

 

[Jim_Lou]

I'm very glad to have another, more experienced, brain working on this with me.

Yes, it is going back SUA. Making steering linkage would be no problem at all for me. The tie rod from the Cherokee is a "Y" setup, with the drag link in it. I could use that, or make something out of the Dodge tie rod, which is a plain rod, but very nice and beefy. Or build something from scratch.

The main objection to either of those is that I think a straight tie rod on the D44 knuckels will clang on the pitman arm when the steering is centered. There was only about an inch of clearance before, and the D44 arms look like they're about an inch longer than the D30. If I don't have a clearance problem I may well change plans.

On the other hand, at full lock the tie rod on the D30 is only about 3/4" from the front of the D30 diff cover, so that could interfere with the larger D44 cover.

I'd like to use D44 everything, but if I only use the D30 knuckle I would think that wouldn't be too bad. It can't be much weaker than the D44 part, and I think I could still use the D44 stub axel and internal-spline hubs. Not sure about that yet, though. That will depend on the ball joint to spindle mount face dimension. I haven't yet measured the knuckles for that.

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.

 

[jeepgod]

jim.. not sure on that hitting the pitman arm.. i ran into that problem with my hi steer setup.. i somewhat fixed it by straightening out the pitman arm.. a stock wagoneer arm.. (not totally straight).. and i have also found a mid 70's dodge pitman arm.. that will work.. and its about an inch shorter than what i have.. but.. its a d30 size hole.. so i now have to ream it out for the d44 tie rod end.. (it has enough material there for it).. unlike a stock jeep pitman arm...

http://www.jeepgod.net

If you are allergic to lead, it is best to avoid a war zone

 

[Jim_Lou]

That shorter Dodge pitman arm sounds like a great option. I will look at that when I get there. Is that from a Dodge pickup? Do you happen to know the angle of that taper? I'll probably have to get a tapered reamer.

I'll bet I could just shorten an arm, too. I'm not afraid to weld one. At least for myself.

I might have been born at night, but it wasn't LAST night.