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5" SUSPENSION LIFT

3.8K views 30 replies 10 participants last post by  JEEPN  
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#1 ·
5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Hi, anybody running the Calmini 5" lift? Anything good or bad I need to know before I purchase for my 87 samurai? Thanks, Lance
 
#2 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Boy, you're opening a can of worms. IMO if you want a simple bolt-on lift the 5" kit is excellent. If you want to do a spring-over you can also buy it in a bolt-on kit from Calmini soon. Stock springs just don't last in spring-over form. You might want to consider buying some 1.5" lifted springs if you go spring-over. Everyone has a different opinion about suspension mods, it just depends on how much you want to spend and your mechanical abilities.
 
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#3 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

We have 5" bolton SPOA kits in stock. They've been around, pounded on hard, and tested for years and so are not something new and experimental. Very easy to follow instructions and no special tools are needed for installation.

We also include long travel shock mounting for a true long travel suspension.

SPOA lifts are not hard on springs, PEOPLE are hard on springs. Thrash about and you can tweak any set of springs no matter what the configuration.

http://www.rocky-road.com
 
#4 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

I'm running the Calmini 5"er. I have no complaints, and with a little modifications (can be done over time), you can get great flex.

I've run with a lot of SpOA rigs and I go where they go (except for those with front lockers, damn I need one). As for road handling, very nice. Shackle reversal really smooths things out, especially bumpy, dirt roads.

If your looking for super flex, might try SpOA. If your not comfortable with welding, Calmini just came out with a bolt-on 6" SpOA, good for 32" or 33" tires. Even comes with new 1.5" lift springs. If you're putting these on an 87, you'll want to replace those old springs. Beware of expensive SpOA kits that don't include everything you need in one price (i.e. springs, shocks, etc.).

As far as bolt-on, Calmini is the leader here. They have an awesome manufacturing facility (not a garage) with state-of-the-art CAD/CAM and laser-cutting processes. Check out whichever vendor you chose carefully. Ask to see a picture of what their facility looks like. Ask others on the board if they have had trouble with them.

As far as buying from Calmini, I've never had any problems. Orders are processed quickly, tech support is great, and product quality is super and well ENGINEERED. I highly recommend them.

Yankee Tim/wwwthreads_images/icons/cool.gif
 
#5 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

I just completed the Zookin' 2K run also, which was awesome. One of the things I took notice of was the flex of each rig. The SOA setup on Max's rig was extremely flexible, and it allowed him and I (we traded rigs day 2) to go places not otherwise possible. I was so impressed I looked into ways around the SOA legalities up here, and found a way this morning. The wife's rig will be SOA, no doubt about it, I was that impressed. If possible you might give that a look-see.

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7" Lift/33" Swampers/REP 8000/RS9000's/Scout II D44's F&R w/4.10's & Lockrights
 
#6 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

true, people are hard on springs, but you cannot honestly say that SPOA's arent... just think about it, more flex = more stress...
you can bend a spring in any config, but it is more likely to happen on SPOA rigs... im pretty sure the shackle reversal has been around long enough not to be considered experimental anymore... and talking about experimental, everytime you make any kind of mod to your rig, you are experimenting with it... seeing just how much more you can get out of it... when i put on my shackle reversal, i was experimenting with my mechanical skills... if i had experimented with a welder, however, it wouldnt have been so pretty....
i personally would much rather experiment with bolts as oppposed to a welder, but thats just because of my mechanical skills, or lack thereof...
so just remember next time you go out to the garage to tweak something, you are experimenting... and many many good things come out of experiments.......

Steve
'88 Suzuki Samurai
2" S/R 30x9.50 M/T's
bassmstr99@aol.com
Texas A&M Off-Road
FTAC of 2003
 
#7 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

I know its a matter of what sami "school" you wanna belong...

What i like alot about my spoa:

. very good flex
.very simple (if you break things in a mud-hole you`ll know about what i am talking)
. can be done on low cost
. extreme good stability/ride ON ROAD (way better than stock)
. very good off-road abilities
. option to put Missing-links in there and make it the ultimate-machine
. get a lot of things out of harms way (u-bolts, shock mounts, etc...)

things i dont like
. you WILL definitely need new springs (and i don't agree... its not just people, its also setups that are hard to springs) within acouple of weeks/months

... any more Q.s? ... feel free to post....

bye
Alfred

ps: cannot comment on the Calmini 5"er
 
#8 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Lance, hope your sammi purchase was a good one. My comments on the five inch calmini lift since you asked are this. Tim has one as he said, it got him everywhere almost that he wanted to go. The two places he did not make it where because he bounced so hard that it put him in peral of rolling. At least that is how I saw it, He could comment better then I on that. I watched his rig closely on the trial because his setup was something I had been considering for my girlfriends rig. After seeing it I decided not to install it. To me it looked rigid and stiff going up and down obsticals and many times I thought it was going over just by its looks, but it never did. Tim is used to it and can drive it with the best of them, but I look at it like this. There is a range of safety when you go up a technical obstical and all is calculated by flex and grip and gearing (not to mention a safety cage should be the VERY FIRST thing you do). I dont have lockers yet, nor a reduced transfer case or gearing. My rig has missing links and a spoa just so you know. I felt that tims lift hindered his rigs true capabilities by the lack of flex. Those springs seemed stiff well they were stiff period, but dont get me wrong he could go almost anywhere. Its just that it seemes a little more on the edge when he did. You should try to go on a run in your area with some fellow zukis to see all the different styles of suspension. Im sure you could find an open seat in a rig and ride along on a run. Zuki folk are a kind people and im sure would be happy to take you along. But here is a flip side, he has a good rig for the road, I chose M/Ls because its not my daily driver and I use it for off road only so that is something to consider. My missing links are way dangerous on the road, but like everyone else you adapt to what you have. I wouldnt let just anyone drive this on the road, theyd panic and wreck it im sure. But thats not what i built it for. There is your feed back, hope it helps. Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif
 
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#9 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Something's wrong with your Missing Links if they're "way dangerous on the road." My Samurai is my daily driver, as is my friend (and fellow ORC Suzuki Tech Editor) Adam Leach's Samurai, both of us have Rocky Road's Missing Links, and they are hardly distinguishable from regular shackles on the road. In fact, my handling tightened up when I replaced my long Con-Ferr shackles with the Missing Links.

I originally thought I would engineer some way to pin down the Missing Links for on-road use, but after driving it, I realized how silly I was for thinking that they'd ever cause a problem on the road. The only time they open up is when there's no weight on the wheel. So when a Missing Link'd suspension would open up the shackles, a regular shackled suspension would lift a wheel off the ground. How often do you do that on-road?

If your Missing Links have affected your handling enough to make your truck "way dangerous on the road" then something is definitely wrong. I have let many non-Suzuki people drive my Samurai both on and off road, and none have ever thought it was dangerous. Tall and flexy, but not dangerous. You need to find out what the problem is, and then consider getting a panhard bar from the front. That should make it handle *better* than stock on-road. Plus, you don't have the screwed-up geometry of the Shackle Reversal, which makes emergency-avoidance maneuvers more dangerous in exchange for a slightly smoother ride under normal driving.
 
#10 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Geoff, I just put the lift on two weeks ago so im not used to it, but I suspect there is something really wrong with my set up. At speeds of 65 to 70 miles per hour the front end starts to act like a teeter totter and sways back and forth. I wonder if my external cage is acting like an aero dynamic varient. I posted on it earlier but recieved no response so assumed this was a regular occurence with this set up. Its that or my shocks are mounted in some way that causes this. I am looking into it this weekend, but i can say this.... My ride is so much smoother then it was. Yes it is tremendously better then stock and the braking really has no nose dive, but I dont sweat the rode handeling too much since as I stated before its built for off road only. Soon I might start towing it behind another rig, but thats only a possible plan. My regards, Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif External cage on a hardtop, x8ki wrn winch, M/L's,pny crb,98amp alt,32's, lckd f/r, j**p eater
 
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#11 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

yeah- like youre going to even need that rig after this weekend! More I thought about it last night< i should have bought that rig! Im jealous! But I m glad you got it. really. honest.

dbenj
88.5 zook, mini mudders, 2"shackles,Thorley Header,K&N,Pony Carb,GM Alt,custom ski bumper
 
#12 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Im not kidding when I say thats for Heidi! I love my rig, its my blood sweat and tears and its got the flex, I just need to gear it down so I dont mess up the springs again. Its perfect for her, and I thought you said there was a cake problem anyway. Lets go check out his friends too ok, but God help me, dont let me buy it ok. And I have not got it yet. Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif External cage on a hardtop, x8ki wrn winch, M/L's,pny crb,98amp alt,32's, lckd f/r, j**p eater
 
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#13 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

right- i can see it now...
M: " Honey, i ve got to run to the Beacon, er, store. Can I take your truck?
H: Sure Max, just make sure to unlock the front when you get back from the "store"...
Yeah- there is a cake problem, but I could of sorted something out. Im in for looking at his buddies rig- you have 5 rigs and thats bad- odd numbers are not good karma. Better buy another.

dbenj
88.5 zook, mini mudders, 2"shackles,Thorley Header,K&N,Pony Carb,GM Alt,custom ski bumper
 
#14 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Max I suspect some of your problems at high speed may be a fixed by a panhard bar. Is it going up and down or side to side? We also haven't done an alignment, and you have yet to check and rebuild the diff knuckles.
(This affects handling acts as a steering dampner.) There are so many variables with this. I am adding a
panhard bar and traction bar at the same time I go Missing link, to solve spring wrap and steering problems I see
with the M/L set-ups and a CV driveshaft too. once built there is no regular suspension other than coils that can
do what a M/L can Period. I think you proved that this last weekend. The SPOA boys ruled. Sure Zooky and I had
locker F/R but Maxs rig didn't on either end. try anything he did with Tim's rig w/o rear locker and it would have been toast. BUT, (I know a BIG BUT) You pay for it in other ways. For the average joe up to the semi-hardcore I
can't recommend this set-up becuase of the work involved. I and Max busted our butt's setting up his rig quick,
to get it done before the run, and it is still verymuch a work in progress as is my rig and I suspect Tim's. next year
we will be crawling up things that we wouldn't think of this year. (And without tweaking my shoulder so bad.)

Glenn Loud
87' Zuke Spoa, 31's, 4.16 tcase, Camo,Header,2"exhuast, Cam.
Locked both ends, 8klb winch, Snorkel -Wildweasel2
NE4WI- club
 
#15 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

***But I m glad you got it. really. honest***

Are you buying it Max? I thought he wasn't going to sell it for that price? Something I missed?

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7" Lift/33" Swampers/REP 8000/RS9000's/Scout II D44's F&R w/4.10's & Lockrights
 
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#18 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

zook-hopefully go SOA this winter. alot to save up for(tcase,spring kit,tires). Im thinking by mid Jan, if Santa is nice to me.

dbenj
88.5 zook, mini mudders, 2"shackles,Thorley Header,K&N,Pony Carb,GM Alt,custom ski bumper
 
#19 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Mark, im working on a deal that I have to have money wired from the west coast and trade one of my sammis (Heidi's) in which means im driving it to washington state on monday. Its so sick and complicated that you should call me on the cell. Or e-mail me your work # ok. Its that rig I saw last night, he called back and we reached a deal, but I have to give him cash by tonight!! so im scrambling hard. Its sickining this sammi addiction, ive got to get help. Now im going to need places to crash(sleep) on my way across the states. call me soon. Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif External cage on a hardtop, x8ki wrn winch, M/L's,pny crb,98amp alt,32's, lckd f/r, j**p eater
 
#20 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Man, go for it, is there any way I can help?

No, you can't have the Conti-Trac's to drive across the US with, sorry. /wwwthreads_images/icons/smile.gif

JEEPN
'81 CJ-8 Scrambled!
GM151/SM465/NP205 twinstick/7" Lift/33" Swampers/REP 8000/RS9000's/Scout II D44's F&R w/4.10's & Lockrights
 
#21 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Max, got to let us know more information, it must be a good deal if you are traveling that far. You are selling Heidi's Sammi? I liked that one, make sure you pull that center console out, maybe Glenn can build that one up for his wife??
 
#22 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

I have just installed TWO Calmini 5" lift kits. On late model Samurai's. These kits are very well made but, be forewarned the research that has gone into them falls short of complete. You must finish the kit yourself. However, it is not hard to do...
The actual installation is relatively easy even for a novice. The only problem that I encountered installing them was the removal of the pitman arm from the steering box. Removing the box from the sammy and using a hydraulic press works best..

NOW as for the end results here goes...

1) After installing the kit per the manufacturers instructions the Sammy rides like a bouncing pogo stick on steroids. The ride quality and "Bumpsteer" was terrible and DANGEROUS! It was making me feel sick after 1/2 hour on the road. I was going to remove the kits and send them back but, decided to experiment with them first.

SOULTION: I eventually ended up removing 2 (smallest)leaves from all of the springs and airing down the tires ( 31 x 10.5 15 ) to 19 psi to get total tread contact with the pavement.

When I first installed the kit (and tires) the total raised height was 8" over stock. After removing the leaves the total lift is now 7" over stock.

One sammy has 235 15's all terrains and total lift is about 6" over stock.

2) A nasty driveline vibration during acceleration in 3rd & 4th gears was evident immediatley after the kit installation. I have driven this sammy since new and now only has 40k miles I have never felt any vibrations until installing this kit. Boy, what a dissapointment...

SOLUTION: remove the centering pins from the stock springs, file them down to fit the new springpack and install 2 degree wedges to decrease the pinion angles towards the transfercase. End Result. 90% of accel vibration has been removed.

3) After the first off-road trip I found a nasty hole punched in the left rear shock. Turns out the Brake line support bracket does a great job of protecting the brake line and destroying the shocks. The shocks supplied with the kit are much larger than the stock shocks and require more clearance. The instructions with the kit are vague and only tell you to check all clearances before putting the sammy back into service. A footnote tells you to install the shocks upside down if clearance is a problem... Well as you probably know, and it doesn't take a genius to figure it out. Shocks are filled with dampening oil and valved to run in one postioin only.. The upsidedown version units are very expensive and built to run in that position only!!! Just for the heck of it I tried to run these shocks upsidedown and boy oh boy!!! What a noisy ride that was!!! The secondary springs were slapping the upper leaves on every bump I hit !!! There was no dampening effect and tons of bouncing...

SOLUTION: Take the brake line out of the retainer bracket, cut the bracket off the axle assy. Re-use the clip that was bolted to the bracket and and use a Wormdrive clap (radiator hose clamp)and sandwich the line and retainer to the axle housing. Do this before you testdrive the sammy or pay for a new set of shocks!!!
No Calmini wouldn't waranty them... They claim that I didn't check my clearances before driving the sammy.
So much for research on their part..... or clear instructions
I've found aftermarket shocks for 1/2 the price and they work much better anyway.

4) After the first outing and a few water holes the grease I used washed off of the bushings causing some very annoying noises, sounded like a 62' Ford going down pothole alley on a dry summer day.EEK!! EEK!! EEK!! It was driving me NUTS!!!

SOLUTION: You need to sand off the mounting areas that have contact with all of the bushings and grease very liberally... Use "Waterproof Marine Grease" during installation and use lots of it!!! Don't use axle bearing grease or white lube it just washes right off after the first waterhole.

After all of these modifications most of the bumpsteer is gone and the ride quality is pretty good. I've driven about 500 street and 200 off-road miles now and experienced no more problems at this point.

Overall: I really do like the lift kit. I can now drive for hours. The articulation it provides is reasonable and the overall product quality was great. My only real complaint was the completeness & clarity of the instructions. And research & development really leaves alot of problems unresolved. I guess testing them in the desert and of-road isn't the same as testing elsewhere. They should tell you it is for off-road only... In some states 4" lift is the maximum lift allowed. In my state it must be tested and certified on a "Flip Table" before inspection is granted.

So how's that for now???
More questions? E-mail me I'll try to answer them.

Caught by the "ZOOKIE OBSESSION" bug. ZOOKIE ZOOKIE ZOOKIE ZOOK.......
 
#23 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Ok here is some more details... Mark after riding with us wanted a rig and I said Id look out. At the event, Dean mentioned Dan webber's rig which Kevin(boston mangler on the jeep forum) mentioned to me too. I said Id go look at it if I got the number, and tell mark about it. The night came for me to look at it and I asked dean to come along for kicks and he knows the area better then me. We get there at night and with the previous notion that Dan is willing to sell for 2000.$ since that is what he said he would do without the amplifiers in it. Great I say, who wants amps under the seat anyway? Not Mark or I or anyone else going into areas with deep water and mud.
I see the rig and its a winner hands down. I couldnt get it because I had no money and Dean was telling me the same thing unless the guy would take 500 or so dollars that night. There was no way that was happening. After talking to him for what seemed like an hour out in the rain and dark cold night, I asked dean if he was getting it, he said no he didnt have the money and i said ok. I go in the car and the first thing Heidi says to me is, man I wish i had that, why cant we get something like that? Well that cut all, I called dad and asked if i could borrow 1,300. and get it tommorow. He said sure (its never this simple) and I popped back out of the car and told dan I could give him 2k for the rig first thing tommorow. He said I dont think so, and me and dean where flabergasted that he changed his mind from last night. After 5 minutes I said im leaving and if he changed his mind to call me.
On the way home in ten minutes dean calls me and says Dan called him and said we could make a deal could I call dan and work it out? I do and we agree on 2100. tommorow night in cash. One time deal. I busted my ass all the next day with phone calls and affirmations from everyone. Meanwhile I have a dilema on my mind, Mark was supposed to get this rig and now its me. I called him and he says that the one thing stopping him is its spoa not spua which is the legalaties in maine. He is looking into a 5" calmini lift in maine that would be legal for him, but if the rig is right then hed buy it and change the axles out. Well i figure, i look at this rig for him in maine for 2k that comes with two extra rigs! and its better for him, and good for me. The day goes by and I have it all lined up and im waiting to meet him at seven. The deal is, I borrow 1700 from my dad and he gets this rig for either elk hunting or to sell whatever he wants to do with it. But I have to drive it over right away, which as it turns out is perfect in timing. I have to be on the west coast to go to edmonton for training anyway as everyone knows. Well 5:50 comes and I call Dan to confirm and get a tele number for dean who has expressed to me that he wishes he could buy the rig now and is sickend with the fact he didnt jump on the opprotunity like I did, but this guy john who is dans friend also has a built sammi for sale. He answers and tells me that I dont need to come down because hes sold it to some jeep guy who offered him 2500. I was floord and pissed off, I tried to explain to him what I have to do now regardless of whether he sells me the vehicle or not. Thats drive 6 days across the us in a sammi to deliver it. Yeah sure I could give the money back, and I will if I dont need it, but a deal is a deal and someone expects a sammi in washington next week. My word is good and ill make the trip. He tells me "well its more money, you can understand that cant you? and I said "so its 400$ to define what kind of person you are??" You broke your word and I busted my ass to satify the conditions you wanted for your rig. He says well we didnt have a contract! and said yes we did we had your word and thats worthless apparently or at least refundable in your mind. He hung up on me.
SO I call dean and tell him whats up. He calls and trys to feel out the situation with dan. Turns out dan was lying and didnt sell the rig,and was trying to see if id jump up to match the price. Ha! But he never presented it to me like I had an opprotunity just that he sold it. Dean says well if your not in a rush id pick it up for 2500. And then they agree that theyd sell it to me for that price but Dan doesnt ever want to see me again! Well dean calls me up with the "good news" and tells me again that he really wants to buy it but would do this for me because if he did their would be bad blood betweeen us. I said Yeah dean, after all ive done and still have to do, id like to buy the vehicle. Well now I have to pay 2500 but I dont have it, so im giving dean 2k and trusting that when I give him the other 500$ as soon as I can that the vehicle will be mine. Its a can of worms, but like my approach on the hills, I dont like to give up, even when they tell me I cant. I can see a way, but its just not pretty. Heidi still wants it, but we are about a month and a half away from recovering on the purchase of this house. In fact its so tight that im driving across the states with 300 on the texaco card and two hundred in cash. The only reason I have that now is because mark is salt of the earth and loaned me a hundred for the road. What a deal huh? Im just glad Dean and Mark are helping out. There is your details, hope it didnt put you to sleep. Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif External cage on a hardtop, x8ki wrn winch, M/L's,pny crb,98amp alt,32's, lckd f/r, j**p eater
 
#25 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

JEEPN, I have a Calmini 5" sitting on my garage floor if you are interested, but I need to know soon, I might use the S/R parts to fit 235's in my new zook, but I would rather sell it as a kit. Bummer Max, hate people like that, guess $400 is worth more then his word
 
#26 ·
Re: 5\" SUSPENSION LIFT

Randy, talked to him on the phone tonight too! He is looking at a rig in maine on friday that comes with two spare parts rigs, (ones a hardtop!)/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif and im sure he could tell you by then. Max

Just one more of the elite Samurai!/wwwthreads_images/icons/wink.gif External cage on a hardtop, x8ki wrn winch, M/L's,pny crb,98amp alt,32's, lckd f/r, j**p eater