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post #1 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 04:35 PM Thread Starter
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Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

OK - Went to a junkyard yesterday - saw two wagoneers - actually one was a '89 Grand Wagoneer - it had a centered D44 rear (I'm positive) & the other was an '8_? Wagoneer with a AMC20 rear. The yard wants a pretty penny for the D44.
What is the difference between the Waggy AMC20 & the CJAMC20 - other than the Waggy has 1 piece & CJ has 2 piece. My problem is that I have been researching this & have come up with conflicting reports - one from the off-road.com tech section & one from a post on the FSJ BBS. The off-road.com tech section does not differentiate the axles other than the one piece axle deal for the Waggy, however the post I read is the following:

================================================== ========
FSJ rears were all some type of Dana 44 through
'79 (exceptions being Dana 60s on some pickups). In
'80 they changed to Heavy Duty AMC 20 rears. I've
heard
rumors that AMC ran short on HD AMC20s a couple of
times and had to buy a few Dana 44s to fill the gaps.
This wasn't comon and I've not seen one from
between '80 and '86 yet. I've had a couple people
swear they had one, but when I looked they had that
round "baby moon" diff cover...
In '87 Chrysler ran out of AMC20s and discontiued
them, all the rest were Dana 44s until the end of FSJ
production.

The HD AMC 20 is really a decent axle with a much
heavier center section than the CJ AMC 20 and much
thicker tubes. You aren't likley to hurt one of these
housings. The axle shafts are also beefy and the
desirable one piece style. They have only 28 splines
but are actually larger than Dana 44 or even 31 spline
Ford
9" shafts. The ring gear on the AMC20 is 8 7/8"
inch, 3/8" bigger than a Dana 44. The pinion is huge
on these as well. All in all, the HD AMC20 is a fine
axle for
swapping into a YJ and every bit as strong as a
Dana 44.

The only thing I don't like about HD AMC 20s is
that they have a crush sleeve for pinion bearing
preload. This must not be a huge draw back since most
axles use
a crush sleeve, but I still prefer shims (like on
a Dana 44) that can't change their settings from
extreme torque.

------------------
John Nutter '85 CJ7
4x4wire editorial staff
================================================== =========
I guess what it boils down to is that I am leaning toward just going with the AMC 20 rather than the D44 due to two things:
1. The AMC 20 is cheaper to purchase off the get go
2. Finding another AMC 20 for spare shafts would be easier & cheaper than finding the rare centered D44 waggy axle.
BUT - I'd like to be aware of anything I'm not thinking of or may be overlooking when comparing these two axles.

I'd appreciate honest thought, opinions & I'd especially like to hear from someone (if anyone) who is running the AMC 20 full-width waggy rear, as to how they like it.

-Mel





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post #2 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 05:46 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

well im not running the axle.. but that post pretty much somes it up.. you put them side by side.. and that hd amc20 has a slight edge.. and is cheaper due to the fact of not many people go looking for them.. that 44 has the name attached to it.. dana.. and everyone wants that.. bah humbug... go with the amc 20.. another problem you run into is gear selection... lowest for the amc20 is 4.88's.. where as the d44 has so many more options out there.. a friend of mine has this hd 20.. and is rebuilding it now.. will install it next month or so..

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post #3 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 06:31 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

The HD Model 20's that were used under the waggies are a VERY GOOD rearend, they are super strong as well.
I really don't think you can go wrong with using it, I know of several guys who are running them and put a terrible beating on those things and have never torn one up yet.
You are right about it being easier to find spare parts, the HD 20 is far easier to find than the D-44 from a 80-newer waggie.
I would choose the HD 20 hands down!!

Peanut

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post #4 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 06:34 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

I sent a reply to your message, but I forgot to add that the last time I was there, at least one centered rear D44 existed. There was also a really old J pickup, like a 3000 or something, had a 5 on 5.5 and was bigger than a 44, like 60 big, but it might be a 53, I didn't really take too much time with it. What yard did you go to looking at axles? Wagner's, north of Zeli, had a 3.31 waggy centered D44 last time I was there about a month ago. Didn't ask a price though.

post #5 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 06:41 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

That old Jeep truck that had the 5 lug rear that was bigger than the D-44 was a D-60. They are pretty hard to come by these days.
It might have been a 53 put that would have to be a really old Kiaser truck. I am not sure of what year they stopped using that 53 rear or what ever that odd-ball rear was before the 60.

Peanut

post #6 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 07:08 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

DOn't know about a d44 - but I just shelled the gears on my AMC 20 R&P last week. All I heard from the guys with me was - I told ya so...and I really did not abuse it that much - I thought. I am going back with another AMC 20. I am going to find out for myself If they deserve the bad rep.

post #7 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 07:18 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

The one thing I haven't gotten a definitive answer on, are the internals of the CJ20 and Wag/J20 the same, that is, can you swap the gears and carrier from one to the other. The answers I always get are yeah, I think so, probably, etc. Has anyone actually swapped them, though. Reason I ask is I am also considering a FS 20, but I sure would like to keep my $450 Detroit Locker.

Brad
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Vice-Pres. Rock Garden 4 Wheelers, Farmington, NM
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post #8 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 07:18 PM
 
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

gears on any axle don tusually shell without some telltalte signs or big tires and stupid peddle.

if you fragmented an AMC 20, no matter how, then I can gurantee you a Dana 44 with the same tires/traction/power blah,m would have given up sooner.

Im taking puctures of both HD amc20 and Dana 33 as I put them together, and Im telling you their is no comparison, dana 44 ring and pinon is alot smaller, and the housing doesnt oil the smaller pinoion gear and bearings as well as the larger AMC20 housign does.

given a the same axles at the same price id go for the amc20, given the amc20 is cheaper, you can buy a spare, but it isnt likely youll ever need one, andif you do, then youll probably be better off with a dana 60 anyway



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post #9 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 07:37 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

Mel,
there was an artical not to long ago in one of the 4wheeling magizines comparing the R&P of the 44 against the 20.
I'll try to find the issue and let you know which one it was.


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post #10 of (permalink) Old 03-27-2001, 07:42 PM
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Re: Waggy rear AMC 20 & D44

hey conter part.. jeepgod01.. what yard are you referrring to.. and where is it.. im looking for another d60-2 that you are speaking of.. and will be traveling to ny in a few months.. so.. i will be doing some shopping along the way...

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