SM 465 troubles - Off-Road Forums & Discussion Groups
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post #1 of (permalink) Old 01-08-2001, 02:05 PM
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SM 465 troubles

I cant get a response on the GM board...It's popping out of 3rd gear at a very annoying rate!! I have 2 of these trannys, and they both do the same thing in 3rd..(let off the gas and as soon as you hit it again, it pops out)Does anyone know how to remedy this? Is it the detent balls on the shift rail not holding or is the gears themselves that cause it.THe gears look fine and so does the sync. ...Thanks...

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post #2 of (permalink) Old 01-08-2001, 04:55 PM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

OK, so I looked this up in one of my manuals, and I find nothing for jumping out of 3rd gear. I found 1st, 2nd, and even 4th, but no 3rd. I'll post the other 3 anyway, maybe they'll help a little.

Jumping out of 1st gear.
1) Insufficient spring tension on shifter rail plunger
2) Bent or loose shifter fork
3) Badly worn gear teeth
4) Gears not angaging completely
5) End play in transmission mainshaft
6) Idler gear bushings loose or worn
7) Loose or worn bearings on transmission mainshaft
8) Defective mainshaft pilot bearing

Jumping our of second gear
1) Insufficient spring tension on shifter rail plunger
2) Bent or loose shifter fork
3) Gears not angaging completely
4) End play in transmission mainshaft
5) Loose transmission gear bearing
6) Defective mainshaft pilot bearing
7) Bent transmission shaft
8) Loose or worn bearings on transmission mainshaft
9) Worn teeth on second speed sliding gear or sleeve
10) End play in countershaft

Jumping out of high gear
1) Misalignment of transmission case or clutch housing
2) Worn pilot bearing in crankshaft
3) Bent transmission shaft
4) Worn high speed idiling gear
5) Worn teeth in clutch shaft
6) Insufficient spring tension on shifter rail plunger
7) Bent or loose shifter fork
8) End play in clutch shaft
9)Gears not engaging completely
10) Loose or worn beearings on clutch shaft or mainshaft.

Well, not sure of how much that helps. You might also try calling a transmission house and talking directly with a mechanic. The manual also lists the "Diagnosis" section independent of the individual sections.

Let me know what you find, who knows when my SM465 may start doing the same thing. Good luck.


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post #3 of (permalink) Old 01-08-2001, 06:47 PM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

A member of my old club has rebuilt a number of these.. I'll bounce this off of him to see if he has any ideas.



Jim O'Brien
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http://www.tidesys.com
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post #4 of (permalink) Old 01-09-2001, 06:31 AM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

Thanks for the insight.I've rebuilt this one, but like I said, the other one I own does the same thing.I was thinking on it this morning, and I'm using the same top for both trannys!! The other top I have is stuck in 2nd gear and has left me too many times stuck/and a long way from home.. I cant recall the other top popping out of gear though!!..I may have answered my own question, but surly I'm not the only person that has experienced this....

post #5 of (permalink) Old 01-09-2001, 10:11 AM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

Leader - feedback from my friend:

This problem can be caused by several things. 1. Was the tranie noisy
at all? sometimes the front or rear bearings go and the gear alignment is
effected. 2. The sincros on the gear side wear slightly and at an angle (that
usually can't be seen with the eye) and tend too push the slider off the
gear. The proper fix for this is too change out the offending gear. Rockland
Standard Gear has a replacement 2nd gear that has a slight angle built into
the gear sincro and holds it in gear. 3. The problem might be fixed, if not
too severe, by putting a stronger spring into the detent and grinding the
detent slot in the shift rail so that the angle for the detent to ride up on
is greater, thus tending too hold it in gear better. This is the easiest as
you only have too remove the top cover. Even if I put new gears in these
transmissions I usually do this.

HTH.



Jim O'Brien
[email protected]
http://www.tidesys.com
post #6 of (permalink) Old 01-09-2001, 12:10 PM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

DO you think that could also cause it to stick in gear by having the detent to deep and the ball not being able to climb back out? I'm going to try it on the other top i have and see if it works.I'm almost sure that a detent ball is sticking in it somhow..I have to basically pull the tranny to get the top off of it in the jeep seeing how the hole in the floor isnt big enough.After the front 60 goes in, this WILL BE my next adventure...Thanks for the replies, and I'll try them out....

post #7 of (permalink) Old 01-21-2001, 04:24 PM
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Re: SM 465 troubles

Here's what you do.... a guy on pirate 4x4 told me about these:

he said "...looking at the pictures and your cluster gear you will see snap rings
betweem 3rd gear and the counter gear( that the big gear by the way).
This is where the problem is. the bevel cut third gear while meshed puts
a strain and torque on the snap rings and wears them and eventually
they break. because movement can occur against the snap rings the fix is
simple , remove the countergear from the shaft and discard the two
snaprings and replace with a sleeve. (pictured) it occupies the area
outlined in yellow. This simple fix was designed by "Tourist Auto" in Salt
Lake City,They have been in the manual tranny business for 75 years. They
were extrememly helpful when I walked into their shop . There phone is
801 -364-5743. They sell the sleeve for $7.50 . You will need to tell
them what tranny you have by examining the trannsmission bolt holes and
tell them wether they are threaded or not. (they can explain more) I
guess some years were two of the holes wre threaded. Now that I think
about it though I dont think this matters unless you are doing a total
rebuild.(rebuild kits with bearings were$190 I think..."

anyway im swapping in an sm465 and adapting to my dana300, then putting in my 350.. so if you have any tips or know of where to get a cheap sm465 to d300 adapter please let me know.....
thanks,
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atroader 82cj7 5"susp 258 T5 D300
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