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post #1 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 02:04 PM
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Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

Hey Guys,

After all the screwing around i did with my carb (weber 32/36) and the rig not running right i swapped on another weber (same model) and i got the EXACT same problem so it isnt the carb. I have a stock 79 258" with a Weber 32/36 carb.

Here are the symptons:

Truck will run but not idle. If i mess with the carb i can get it to either idle nice and run losey or vice versa. I have checked the timing and it is fine. I have also tweaked it but that didnt cure anything.

The rig had about 8 months down time where it sat. I left the key on by accident for 2 weeks and have replaced everything that might have been fried (ignition module, battery, coil, wires, rotors, and so forth) and still no luck.

The kicker here is that the truck ran mint before it sat.

Could the gas sitting in the fuel pump ruin the diapram?

I just want some opinions or ideas before i start buy expensive stuff.

Anyone have any ideas to try? This is really driving me nuts.

Thanks


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post #2 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 02:19 PM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

When you say won't idle...Like when you have a vacuum leak or disconnected line someplace...Maybe vacuum advance for the distributor.???? Just a thought...

Tommy B. in AZ -
post #3 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 02:39 PM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

i have checked and doubled checked all the lines. I even sprayed everything with carb cleaning while i had a friend hold it at idle to check for a change in RPM's. I didnt get any change so i figure they must be ok.

thanks for the idea

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post #4 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 02:53 PM
 
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

8 months is a long time to sit. I'm thinking maybe the gas went bad. It could've gotten a lot of water in the tank from condensation in that time. Try some gas drier. It's eaiser than pulling the tank!
BTW, nice website!

'86 CJ-7, 360, T-176, Dana 44 rear w/Truetrac, Dana 30 w/No-slip, 4" Superlift, Slickrock hangers, Currie steering brace, JKS discos, 4:11s, Warn HS9500i on Durango bumpers.
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post #5 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 02:57 PM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

you could try gravity feeding the carb from a can of fresh gas. that would tell you if it's your fuel system or not.

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post #6 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 03:02 PM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

>>>>>you could try gravity feeding the carb from a can of fresh gas. that would tell you if it's your fuel system or not.

***** A few people have suggested this. I will be trying it first thing in the AM

thanks

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post #7 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 04:23 PM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

Mangler, when you set it so it idles nice, does it have a nice even reading on a vacuum gauge, around 18-21 inches Hg.? If so, and it's getting enough gas to run, it can't be the gas. [img]/wwwthreads_images/icons/crazy.gif[/img] My Jag sits over the winter (and sometimes longer) with gas in the tank, and I personally don't think it goes bad that quickly. Of course, that's in a garage, not outside.

If it's not the carb, or the gas, it's got to be ignition or timing based. How many miles on the timing chain and gears? Could it have jumped a tooth when you fired it back up? Have you checked TDC on #1 piston to the position on the rotor? There aint much left after that - gas, spark, timing. That's all there is. [img]/wwwthreads_images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

Just random thoughts.
Good luck
Pete [img]/wwwthreads_images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

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post #8 of (permalink) Old 12-07-2000, 07:21 PM
 
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

Use fuel stabilizer in the gasoline, and make sure the fuel tank is topped off full.
Air space will cause water condensation to form.

Unhook the fuel line at the carb, and crank the engine over with the fuel line in a LARGE jar where you can see the fuel flow.
You should get about 1/4 to 1/2 pint per 'Squirt'....
If not, your fuel pump has given up.

This will give you a first hand look at the fuel that is getting into your carb... Just an added plus...
-------------------------------

Just a shot in the dark, but did you do a resistance test on the distributor pickup coil and the ignition coil?
Both take a beating when you leave the key on.
------------------------------

I know I sound like a broken record, but you have to VERIFY every system...
One step at a time...

Pay particular attention to vacuum readings, especially at idle and just off idle.
They will tell you more than anything else will.

I'm posting that short vacuum diagnostic page again, maybe it will help narrow down your problem.
--------------------------------

IS A VACUUM GAUGE A MANDATORY TOOL?????

Is A Vacuum Gauge A Mandatory Tool??.... You Bet Your Life It IS!!

The entire combustion process demands continuous high and low pressure cells to operate.
A vacuum gauge lets us 'see' the invisible low pressure cells inside the engine, and with a good working knowledge of a few basic principals of nature, we can figure out what is wrong with an engine.

This is mostly for those of you with stock engines, or engines that have been slightly modified, which is most of you...

1. Vacuum readings are mandatory to tune ANY carburetor. The most tuneable carburetor on the market is a Holley, and you will learn to live and die by the vacuum gauge tuning one of them.

2. Nearly every fuel injection system has a manifold pressure sensor. That Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) sensor, combined with input from other sensors, determines fuel delivery volume and ignition advance in modern vehicles.
It's the fuel injection computer's vacuum gauge. Fuel injection wouldn't work without it.

3. Many millions of transmissions have vacuum inputs. Those inputs can be tuned by knowing what the vacuum is doing when the transmission is supposed to be shifting, and how to change the input of the vacuum information into the transmission.

4. Nearly every single older ignition system has a vacuum advance canister. It is impartial to know what the vacuum in your engine is doing when the distributor advance curve is programmed into the distributor.

5. Knowing what your 'Normal' engine vacuum is supposed to be is really the key in finding problems easily with a vacuum gauge. Taking vacuum readings, especially idle vacuum, is real easy, takes virtually no time, and will be a life saver when something goes wrong.
Taking regular vacuum reading at idle and through the RPM range up to about 2,500 RPM is the ONLY way to know exactly what is 'Normal' for your vehicle, especially if you have modified the engine in ANY way...

----------------------------------
WHAT TO USE,
Use an UNDAMPENED or UNDAMPED vacuum gauge. None of the fancy and expensive 'buffered' or oil filled gauges, they are worthless for our purposes.
Most of the better vacuum gauges intended for automotive service are satisfactory.
Try to get a quality gauge, Sears or better. A cheap gauge can not only miss a lot of things, but can give false readings.
-----------------------------------
WHAT TO LOOK FOR,

(paraphrased from a rebuild manual)
1. A steady reading between 16 and 22 in.Hg. at idle...
This is normal for most vehicles.
Radically cammed engines have lower, less steady readings.

2. Normal range at idle, with sporadic drops below normal,
This could indicate a sticking valve.

3. Normal range at idle with needle vibration of about 2 in.Hg.,
This could indicate an ignition problem. Check plug gap, dwell (yes, electronic ignitions have dwell too), cap, rotor, and plug wires.

4. A steady reading slightly higher than normal.
This can be caused by a dirty air filter, or overly advanced ignition timing.

5. A steady reading 3 to 12 in.Hg. lower than normal.
This could indicate one or more of the following conditions,
Intake or carburetor vacuum leak, Late ignition or cam timing, Worn piston rings.

6. Gauge needle drifts slowly over a range of 4 to 5 in.Hg. at idle,
This could indicate an idle mixture that is too rich or too lean.

7. Gauge needle fluctuates rapidly between 10 and 21 in.Hg. at idle,
This could occur when one or more valve springs are weak or broken.

8. Gauge reads normal at idle, but drops slowly as engine speed is increased to 2,500 RPM,
This could indicate a restricted exhaust system.

9. Gauge reads below normal and fluctuates rapidly over a range of about 3 in.Hg. at idle, then the needle becomes steady as engine speed is increased,
Worn intake guides usually cause this reading.


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post #9 of (permalink) Old 12-08-2000, 07:12 AM
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Re: Rig Still Wont Run. Desperate Plea

Hey Teamrush,

thanks for all the info. i know what i am doing all weekend. i will keep everyone posted

thanks again

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