Am i hot or not??? UPDATED WITH PICS... - Off-Road Forums & Discussion Groups
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post #1 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 03:20 AM
FrenchJeeper
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Am i hot or not??? UPDATED WITH PICS...

Hello....

Well, i am working on tuning my TBI setup and i came to a point where i need your opinion badly...
As you know the ECM uses a temp sensor to work. I placed it on the hoses going to the heater motor as you can see on this pic:



But, when the temp gauge in the Jeep reads 200F the ECM reads around 20F less...
So, should i relocate it and, if yes, where and how???
Thanx for your help...


***UPDATE***

Well, i remembered a post a few weeks ago where i Jeeper was asking about some sensors that were on the driver side of his 258 and he posted a pic with the question...
So, i went out, crawled under the Jeep and found a plug that looked like one i could use. I took it off (drunk a few cup of cooling fluid whch defenitely taste bad [img]images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) and began to screw my sensor in...
Well, before screwing it all the way in i would like to know if any of you know how deep is the hole???
I am sure it is a good spot for the temp sensor as long as i can put it all the way in...So, if you have a 258 laying somewhere please, tell me how deep it is!!! It is located down the number 4 cyl exhaust...
Thanx a lot...
Here a some pics in case you don t understand me.... [img]images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]







Thanx a lot for your help....
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post #2 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 06:43 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

I would say "YES" move it. You want to get a true reading from your engine not your heater core. Look for a plug on the head or engine block to get a good temp reading for your ECM.
post #3 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 07:19 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

Say ...those are some nice braided stainless steel lines you have there, Eric (visions of T2 when he came upon a motorcycle cop and said, "Say ....that's a nice bike") [img]images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

...but I must ask ...

Is this causing some operational problem?

Are you sure you're on the outlet TO the heater ...and not the return? I could see you losing 20 degrees through the heater core. Btw- does your heater core run full time ..or is there a flow control valve that ihibits flow? If your heater flow is dead headed I could see the sensor cooling enough to explain the difference.

If they're the same size thread ...swap them around and see if there is any change.
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post #4 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 07:35 AM
 
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Re: Am i hot or not???

You MUST move it closer into the flow of the engine coolant.
A splice of tubing with a threaded base for the sensor hose clamped next to the thermostat housing would be best/easiest.
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post #5 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 07:37 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

One problem that I see is using the heater lines. These lines will only work after the t-stat fully opens. This should give "slow" readings. It may be a lot easier to just pick up a 4.0l's t-stat housing, and installing it there. This should give much more accurate readings and should be easier to install. In fact, I think the sensors from an earlier 4.0 are the same as the GM style. It should just screw in perfectly.
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post #6 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 08:01 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

Dorfs, thats not true. Water bypasses the t-stat to go to the heater. If it didn't you you wouldn't get any heat at all untill it was fully up to temp. I assume the 4.0 housing has a sensor mount in it? Thats a great idea. I could use that myself. [img]images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
I added an aftermarket guage in addition to the stocker and it is ties into a T right on top of the thermo housing. It does work OK but is still a few degree's off the eng temp. (I have an infra red thermometer) I would relocate the sensor to the intake for what you need it for. I'm sure you can find a place to put it. If there is no empty holes, find an undrilled boss thats part of the water jacket and drill/tap it yourself. You will need as close to actual eng temp as possible for the FI to work right.
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post #7 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 08:04 AM
 
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Re: Am i hot or not???

Even better, Dorfs ...

I was going to suggest that but wasn't sure the newer style housing would match Frenchie's block, or that a newer housing would be very easy to locate over there.

BTW: Did you get moved and settled into your new job?
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post #8 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 08:05 AM
 
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Re: Am i hot or not???

Unless further modified, the heater hose line receives coolant flow unimpeded by the thermostat. Isn't there a bung on the intake manifold where you could install the sensor?

Should read very accurately if it's on the outlet side of the heater core loop, as that flows continuously. I would definately avoid having it on the return stretch.

If it does read low (and it's not simply that your other gauge is inaccurate) it will prolong the warm up cycle being performed by your ecu. It will make it richer for longer, and idle faster longer.

Nice looking intake manifold. Obviously it's water heated version. The stock intake manifold has at least 3 holes for 2 coolant sensors and one cto switch. The block should have a cto hole as well on the drivers side.

The gm sensor I am using will screw right into the holes on the intake. Never tried the one on the side of the block.

I see a lot of hoses there [img]images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img], not sure how you have plumbed the intake manifold into the coolant loop, but I would have all coolant flow through the intake manifold, not just a by-pass of the main loop.

If that sensor's in the main stream, it should read accurate. Probably better than the stock jeep gauge.

Hows it running?
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post #9 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 08:36 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

Didn't start the new job yet, not until the first of the year. That may be a bitch, driving 60 miles a day into Salida. I am moved in. Cleaning out the garage was quite a chore. The new place here in Cotopaxi is awsome! 9,300 ft. where the elk and deer play. Some of the best elk hunting is right here in my back yard, Waugh Mt.

The garage is only a foundation and slab at present. I am not sure how it will look with a 14 ft. celing to clear the lift, but what the hell, I have no neighbors to complain. p.s. I now have 2 virgin, in box 4.0l heads under the tarp. Someday I might get a chance to run down to NM if you want. Just hope I don't run into my X down there.

DirtDog, I guess you are right about the t-stat. and the heater lines. Looking at the housing there is a by-pass around it.
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post #10 of (permalink) Old 12-14-2002, 08:53 AM
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Re: Am i hot or not???

1. Yes the thermostat housing does have a bypass, however,
2. IMHO I'd put a "T" on the heater hose attachment point on the manifold and install the thermostat there to more accuratly follow the manifold coolant.
3. There is a slight drop as the heat follows the heater hose up and around the engine.
4. Baring that susggestion... I'd drill and tap the manifold...
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