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post #1 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 01:36 PM
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OT--This guy simply does not get it

Atheist Takes New Swing at God in Government
Friday, August 30, 2002


WASHINGTON The California atheist who challenged the words "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance is now going after taxpayer-funded chaplains in Congress.

"If they want a pep talk, then go get a football coach ... but stop getting chaplains and religious folks to come in. It's forbidden," Michael Newdow, a Sacramento-based lawyer and physician, said in an interview Friday.

In a suit filed in U.S. District Court here this week, Newdow said House and Senate chaplain positions compromise a constitutional ban on government-sponsored religion and religious requirements for public servants. The suit names as defendants the Congress and other administrators.

Newdow's suit seeks to abolish the jobs, but makes no specific request for damages.

"It's a civil rights case ... atheists are second-class citizens in this society," Newdow said in the telephone interview. "Even if (the chaplains) weren't getting paid, it's wrong for government to be saying that there's a God. These are religious ideals and the government's not supposed to be weighing in."

Senate Minority Leader Trent Lott, R-Miss., said most people are "comforted by the fact that our chaplains lead us in seeking guidance from a superior power."

All House and Senate chaplains since 1789 have been Christians, the lawsuit notes. The House chaplain now earns $148,500, and Senate chaplain makes $130,000.

A three-judge panel of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco sided with Newdow in June, finding unconstitutional the phrase "one nation under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance. That decision drew an onslaught of criticism from Capitol Hill, and the Justice Department has since asked the full 9th Circuit court to review it.

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post #2 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 01:53 PM
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

Sounds like we need to get a bunch of Leve's Geezer buddies together and go kick this guys a55.

What a moron. OK i'll leave it there, have to get ready for work not itme to break out the soapbox :-)

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post #3 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 02:19 PM
 
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

I personaly dont think that organized religeon deserves all of the tax breaks ,and such that they have benn garnished in the past.
I definitely dont like the idea that my tax dollars are going towards, high paid chapplans. If someone needs a preist they go down to their local church and talk to one.
It wouldnt hurt my feelings if this guy won this battle.
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post #4 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 02:50 PM
 
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

I agree with Jeff,,,,,,,,,,,,
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post #5 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 03:17 PM
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

Me too. However, on the other side of the fence, I don't believe it's right to tax people for public schools if they're kiddies go to private. Give them vouchers.
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post #6 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 04:06 PM
 
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

Taz, if the government gave people vouchers to go to private schools, then there would be a seriuos degradation of the public school system. The people who couldn't afford the private schools even with the voucher would have to suffer.

If you can afford to send your child to a private school, then do it, and support the not-so-fortunate children by paying taxes so they can have a good education.
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post #7 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 04:30 PM
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

How about those who do without and barely make ends meet so they can send their kids where they'll get a better education? Meanwhile, the next door neighbor working in the same factory, making the same wages, drives his new SUV to spend his at the local pub while his kids go to the public school war zones.

If you had the kids, they are your responsibility, not the public's. If you can't afford them or aren't willing to give up a few things for them, put them up for adoption where they'll get a good home.
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post #8 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 04:47 PM
 
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

One of the great things about America is that we have a strong public education system beacuse of tax dollars. Public schools give EVERYONE, rich or poor, the opportunity for an education. Without tax dollars, public schools would be nothing. The dropout rate would be astronomical, the unemployment rate would be sky high! Do you honestly think that someone as selfish as Mr. SUV is going to send his kids to private school if it means that he can't go down to the pub and have a few beers then drive home in his Navigator? I don't.

I pay my tax dollars just like everyone else. I don't have children, but would hope that when I do, they can get the education they deserve in public schools or private. I don't gripe that the system is spending my hard earned $$$ on other people's kids - I'd rather have them in school than breaking into my house and stealing stuff because we took the tax dollars away from public schools, the kids dropped out and couldn't get a job because they have no education.

You're right, if I had kids they would be my responsibility. I'd make sure that they got the education they are entitled to.

To put things another way, if you lost your job and couldn't meet the financial needs of supporting your family, would you collect welfare if it meant that your kids would have a roof over their heads and food on the table?
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post #9 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 05:38 PM
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

<blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr>

Do you honestly think that someone as selfish as Mr. SUV is going to send his kids to private school if it means that he can't go down to the pub and have a few beers then drive home in his Navigator? I don't.

<hr></blockquote>Of course not, that's why I brought it up.

Now, Mr. And Mrs. Mykidscomefirst are ashamed to go to Aunt Nellie's funeral because their clothes are hopeless out of date and have been washed so many times they've lost their shape. Their kids however are the best dressed kids in school, all bought on sale. Now, since they're paying for public schools for Mr. SUV's kids and they aren't using them themselves, doesn't that mean they're paying for the beer that Mr. SUV is drinking?

Justify it all you want, it still isn't fair!

BTW - That literal "you" in the previous post was not directed at you personally, rather at the multitudes that want me to pay their kid's way through life.
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post #10 of (permalink) Old 09-01-2002, 05:44 PM
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Re: OT--This guy simply does not get it

I have to agree with H8 on this, just why are these guy's getting paid with my tax money? If a Senator wants to talk to a chapland or what ever let him go to church like any one else. I think that definately violates the seperation of church and state.
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