ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline? - Off-Road Forums & Discussion Groups
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post #1 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline?

Ok ..without going into major detail ..does anyone know off hand if lifter bores in the AMC/DC inlines are able to be drilled and sleeved like a V8? As you can imagine this is a technically simple task on a V8 because of access. In the case of the AMC/DC inline engines I just wonder if you scrap the block if the lifter bores are too far out (or just ignore it and hope for the best).

TIA
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post #2 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 01:35 PM
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline?

I have never heard of it being done, but anything is possible. I would think it not worth the effort unless the block was blueprinted. Even then it might not be worth it.

Whether to scrap the block or cross your fingers depends on how bad it is. Is it worn or scored?
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post #3 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 01:48 PM
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline?

I don't see why it wouldn't work. Lifter bore's are very similar to the Ford sizes. If you don't re-sleeve the lifter's going to be walking all over the place inside that bore and causing vale opening and closing disparagies. You'll have to discuss this with a good mechanist. The process is simply heating the bore and cooling the sleeve. Then drop the new sleeve in and it's a nice tight force fit. You might beable to machine some GM re-sleeves to do the job.

It's still cheaper than a new block.
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post #4 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 01:49 PM Thread Starter
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline?

Neither... I'm trying to bring the bores into Chevy or Ford size (around .840 instead of the .905 for the AMC/DC inline).

It's one of those "what in the world would you want to do that for" ..or ..."it ain't worth the money" or "it's cheaper to do this" type thingie.
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post #5 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 02:14 PM Thread Starter
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inline?

That's what I'm trying to do LEVE ..bring it up (down) to Chevy size. I figured I'd run it by the board before I picked up the phone or spent a visit to the many local machine shops.

Ok ..I'll spill the beans and take the flack (why would you spend that much effort and $$$ to do that when you could do xxx).

I want to put a roller cam in my 2.5 (and 4.0 ..but that will be a little more difficult to find a cam/man. for a L6 especially out of steel billet)

The inlines don't have line of sight between the lifter bores so you can't use the typical horizontal bars that most roller lifters use. You could fab some type of insert that duplicates the "spider" that the OEM Ford or GM hydraulic roller lifters use ..but that will still require the bores to be sleeved PLUS having someone make an insert that will contour the webbing of the block for each and every lifter (many more $$$ and with unknown reliabilty).

Crower now makes a "groove lock" roller lifter. You merely drill a slot in the lifter bore and the roller lifter tracks in that slot (drill bit and drill jig provided by Crower). This eliminates virtually all obstacles to this installation.

Assuming that the reboring/sleeving of the lifter bore is possible all that is left is getting someone to put the appropriate shaft stock in the lathe and punch in the numbers for it to puke out a cam ....(for some reason this is a very expensive part of this project).

Yes, probably buying a V8 would be cheaper...so would driving a Geo Metro[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img][img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
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post #6 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 05:34 PM
 
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inl

You may want to consider the Ford factory sizes. Ford used roller cams in it's SVO engines in Europe, and the lifters & necessary hardware are off the shelf.
I don't know about lobe spacing on the Ford Vs. AMC, but the lifter sets shouldn't be hard to change center on, and they are self aligning being connected, and don't require any special machining.


Tons of the midget racing guys (Chrysler, GM & Ford) and Formula Ford guys are using the same setup.
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post #7 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 07:37 PM Thread Starter
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inl

I've thought of using the OEM roller from Ford ..but I can't use a connected (paired) lifter because of the the block webbing (if I understood you correctly). I'm unsure on the L4 ..but on the L6 its 6 individual semi circle chambers (1 for each lifter) that do not have line of sight between them. I would not be so fortunate to have AMC/DC use side covers like Ford (and I think Chevy) did on their inline 6's. For those who have them ..it's reduced to spending the time (and $$$$) to find a cam man to grind one out for an inline.

I've also considered the Ford non-connected roller (it's the one that is like a "Lincoln Log" - circular at the ends and flat surfaces in the middle) ..but it will require the fabrication of something to act as a stand alone "leg of the spider" that they use (a forked thingie that the flat part of the lifter track within - when used under a V intake ..I've heard it refered to as a spider). I saw these just the other day on a 3.8 supercharged Ford T-bird that had the intake and heads off for a head gasket job.

I still believe that I'll have to sleeve the bores of the AMC/DC block. I think Ford's is closer to the Chevy lifter in dia.

Thank you kindly for your input[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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post #8 of (permalink) Old 07-06-2002, 07:45 PM
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inl

Somebody used to make a roller conversion for SBC engines where the lifters had 'cheeks' that hung down below the bottom of the roller. The shaft was turned small enough, and the sides of the lobes were finished, so that the cheeks straddled the lobe and kept the roller straight. It might have been Iskendarian.

To sleeve the bore directly from .905 to .840 would take a sleeve with .032" wall thickness. As Leve says, with a hot block and refrigerated sleeves, and a good installation arbor, it might be possible to press them right in. You would have to have a good grinding shop make them for you, because they would have to be VERY precise. I would guess that it would would be a $200 to $300 to grind the ID and OD. A lot cheaper if you could get the stock with the ID already sized.

It does seem like one of those ideas that will turn out to be more effort than its worth. What is your goal for this project?


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post #9 of (permalink) Old 07-07-2002, 01:54 AM Thread Starter
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inl

From what I understand the reboring and sleeving of lifter bores is fairly common in the minor league race circuit. My race engine builder buddy (not a machinist in a machine shop) basically said that you don't scrap a two year old Dart block because one lifter bore (or all of them) being out of spec. They apparently have a "done" proceedure for this (I don't know the details - it may very well involve the "cold welding" technique that LEVE mentioned). This looks fairly simple on a V8 with the lifter bores sitting in an open lifter valley, probably just a little more difficult than installing a new set of valve guides..but in the AMC/DC inline??? Then again ..some machine had to machine the bores for the block to begin with..so it obviously must be possible ..now practical that's another issue.

Yes, this is going to be an expensive project, if at all doable (with my wallet) ..but I don't belong to the "bigger is better" crowd - [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]. I will probably spend more than a V8 swap and yes, cubes are the cheapest way to horsepower. I figure if someone can spend a fortune to get a rig to crawl up a rock wall ....I can spend a fortune to do it in a four banger.

Goals?? Besides a superior valve train and extended rpm capability? - not much other than someone said "what in the heck would you want to do that for?" (the assumption being that anything outside of their perceived realm of viability is invalid while never exploring it to find out) ..and nobody else (to my knowledge) has ever done it. Remember ..never get in the way of a man parting with his money [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img][img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

Look at it as building a better mouse trap for genetically altered mice[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Thanks very much for your input[img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]....I'll check out Isky to see about those lifters ..this is the first that I've heard of them.

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post #10 of (permalink) Old 07-07-2002, 11:06 AM
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Re: ever drilled and resleeved a lfter bore on inl

Good luck! It does sound interesting. That was at best a guess that Isky made those lifters, but I know SOMEbody did. It wouldn't be much help to find an oldtimer who says "We quit making those years ago," but at least it would stop your wasting time looking any more.
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