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  #1  
Old 01-17-2005, 07:30 PM
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Default EGR Valve, Do i need it

I'm assuming the egr valve is the thing with a vaccum port on the intake manifold and it connects from the intake to exhaust manifolds. Do i need it? Can i just plug the pipe going into it with pipe plugs? The vaccum line wasn't hooked up before and now my jeep is completely gutted of all emissions stuff. If i left the pipe between the 2 manifolds in and didn't hook it up would it be fine? I'm trying to get rid of as much useless stuff as i can under the hood.
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  #2  
Old 01-17-2005, 07:56 PM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

Yes...that is the EGR. It lets in calculated amounts of exhaust gas to reduce the amount of O2, thus reducing emissions.

A little bit a caution here....
By 'gutting the emissions', you are actually hurting the performance and driveability of your jeep. While your state may not have emissions laws and testing now, no doubt it will be a short time before it does. I believe most states already have laws regarding modifications to emissions controls, especially on such a new vehicle.

What puzzels me even more...if your profile is correct, then all of your jeeps are fuel injected. Why in the world would you want to remove the emissons stuff? I can not think of anything that you can remove that would improve performance (except maybe the EGR). In fact, it will most likely cause problems with the computer and hurt gas mileage and performance. In most cases, the items have no negative effect on power....with the charcol canister being an example. It quietly collects raw gas fumes from your gas tank and them feeds them to the engine when it is running. Take it off, and you will start smelling raw gas.

Then there is the little issue of selling the vehicle. Good luck....it would cost more to put all the items back than most people would want to pay....

I can't help but ask....WHY?
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:00 PM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

i had a non-functioning EGR for a while on my CJ and didnt know it

cap it and see how it goes....i dont think it'll make any issues unless you are emissions testing...

in the words of Caterpillar, on the topic of EGR...."NEVER TRUST ANYTHING THAT EATS ITS OWN WASTE"
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:02 PM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

after reading DDawgs post.....i need to elaborate that im under the assumption your going to be removing pretty much everything related to anything on the block and workign from there to give you a more powerful motor...is that a correct assumption? or is John correct in assumign you want to use the Injection sys with no emissions?
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Old 01-17-2005, 09:06 PM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

Recirculating A LITTLE exhaust lowers the combustion temperature a little. By lowering it slightly Oxides of Nitrogen almost completely stop forming. That's a very poisonous gas (NOx - it forms 13 different ones, none of which is laughing gas) - and it's that brown stuff you see hanging in the air.

Older engines, like 80's, suffered a little when it was added onto the engine of that day. Even though it wasn't legal, removing, blocking them off was common - it did help.

Since then engines have been re-designed to actually need slight EGR - without it they will ping and do all sorts of drivability problems.
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Old 01-18-2005, 03:05 AM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

At the risk of getting ranted again, I'm driving my '88 XJ without an EGR for 3 years now without any problems. Newer i6 engines (post Renix) do without the EGR because of different exhaust timing doing almost the same as the EGR. It reduces combustion temp a bit. I can be honest why I took it out. The diafram was busted, the EGR functioning was doubtfull, a previous owner blocked the vaclines so the cheapest thing to do was removing all parts and vacuumspagetti. I guess this rig was driven a few years without EGR before it was mine. I have a bit more space in the engine bay now.

Smog test over here only involves CO at idle. The EGR doesn't do anything at idle.
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Old 01-18-2005, 07:58 AM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

Very true -- EGR is non functional at idle - and at wide open throttle.

The only real way to find out how it's going to affect your engine, no matter what year, is try it! You quite possibly will get an increase in power - EGR does rob power -- usually.

Smog testing -- different states -- and different countries obviously have different rules. Many places do not use a dyno for smog testing -- and NOx emissions only occur when the engine is loaded, so a dyno must be used to create it so it can be tested.

Many places have laws that make it illegal to remove or change emissions equipment - usually visual inspection finds that. Some have the law in place but don't enforce it. Some only test the emissions with the hood closed -- if it fails the emissions test, the hood gets opened to see why - then you get failed if anything is missing or disconnected.
So many different ways!!!

Most of the time to disable an EGR valve it only entails removing the vacuum line to it. Unless the valve itself is stuck open or it's defective, the "no vacuum" condition is it's closed.

If the engine pings after disconnecting the EGR valve when it didn't before, you have one that needs it. You may be able to set timing down a little lower, or use a higher octane gas to stop the ping - both are worth a try.

I suggest if you do disable the EGR, just plug the line, do not discard the controls for it - like temperature valves, relays etc. Just plug the line. Someday the greenies will get the laws changed - you'll need it someday. Then if everything's still there, just plug the line in again. "Ooops, I'm sorry, I was experimenting one day and forgot to put it back."


For the techies -- NOx forms at a "magic" temperature around 3000 degrees and under pressure (combustion pressure.) What happens is Nitrogen "welds" to Oxygen, forming 13 different variations of Nitrous Oxides. The oxides are corrosive and highly reactive - easily combine with lots of elements, several form smog. Deadly to breathe. Under load there's lots of pressure and heat, enought to drive it over that "magic" temp.

After discovery they found that if they spaced the molecules apart slightly with Helium it dropped NOx emissions considerably. But Helium is expensive. They needed an inert gas to space the molecules apart slighly.

Exhaust gas is semi inert for that purpose - supposedly it has very little oxygen and no fuel - if it already burned properly. Adding just a tad of exhaust was cheap and easy. Thus - Exhaust Gas Recirculation.

Very late model engines have some EGR built into the cam's overlap and design of the combustion chambers - but they can't have too much of it or idle gets bad from mifire.
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Old 01-18-2005, 08:06 AM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

Not to add to the fray but as it relates to any internal combustion engine, the EGR system does shorten warm-up time (less wear and carbon build-up) and stabilizes combustion as long as the thermal ported vacuum valve that controls it is actuating at the correct time. Even if it's strictly off road (no I/M testing to worry about) I'd keep the EGR system in tact.
Just my opinion...
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Old 01-18-2005, 09:54 AM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

My profile is wrong, I have an '87 yj with the 258. I'm swapping out the carter for a mc2100 and am not sure what i'm going to be doing with the ignition. My jeep ran like poop with the carter and several other issues i'm working out right now. My jeep is pretty much a trail only jeep anyways and sees very little road time and i'm not worried about the sniffer.
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Old 01-18-2005, 10:20 AM
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Default Re: EGR Valve, Do i need it

He He -- not to argue but -
Just wondering -- how can it help warm up an engine when the thermal valve inhibits it's operation till the engine's warm?

EGR on a cold engine makes it really hard to drive, stumbles, buck etc. -- try it.
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